Question – What is the difference between a liberal and a puppy?
Answer -A puppy stops whining after it grows up.

Question – What is the only thing worse than an incompetent liberal President?
Answer -A competent liberal President.

Question – Who was the first liberal Democrat?
Answer -Christopher Columbus. He left not knowing where he was going,got there not knowing where he was,left there not knowing where he’d been and did it all on borrowed money.

Q: How many liberals does it take to change a light Bulb?
A: At least ten, as they will need to have a discussion about whether or not the light bulb exists. Even if they can agree upon the existence of the light bulb they still may not change it to keep from alienating those who might use other forms of light.

Q:How many liberals does it take to change a light bulb?
A:None. Liberals wouldn’t actually change the light bulb, but they would show compassion for it by talking a lot about how terrible it is in the dark and more funding is needed to improve dim, 60 watt bulbs up to bright and productive 100 watt bulbs.

Q: How many liberals does it take to change a light bulb?
A: Let George Bush fix it! It’s his fault it’s dark anyway!

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  1. donald says:


  2. donald says:

    the other side and all the other siders do not belong in America, you should all move to Iran or North Korea where your views would be right in line. You would not have to change anything, their countries are already in line with your opinions. Merry Christmas.

  3. Burhnas Stefvanslof says:

    Funny, First Monday of the Month should insult the nearest liberal. But you cant do that at work because they aren’t any. No one is a OBAMA supporter anymore, even those that had the stupid bumper stickers on their car and on office sutff

  4. Shane says:

    Not bad. I’ve heard better, though. And to “zoot patatoe”, only that first joke was kind’ve funny, but I’ve definitly heard better conservative jokes. And to all, liberals may not COMPLETELY dislike this country, they just want to change it into they’re own deformed image.

  5. Castor says:

    I’m not gonna deny, I don’t think 9/11 is anyone’s favorite holiday aside from Al Qaeda, Hamas, and the muslims across the street from me.

    As for all the other stuff other side said, I disagree. I don’t believe that liberals hate America, and I don’t know anyone who does. I just believe that they don’t know how to run things properly.

    One more thing, you were the first one to respond to his post. Nobody else even got the chance the “demonize” him before you called us out on it. Much like my girlfriend chews me out for not taking the garbage out yet when I just… woke… up.

    Nice necropost by the way.

  6. The Other Side says:

    patriotic conservative is probably a troll who writes whatever idiotic things they think of…but i can’t sit here and not respond to pc saying that 9-11 is a liberals favorite holiday. what is wrong with pc? do they actually think that liberals hate america? to be honest, i bet they do. and that is what is dividing america. this vitriolic/violent/dangerous rhetoric comes mostly if not all from conservatives. this language (dehumanizing the other side) causes the violence from the right wing around the country and the right wing hate mongers on fox news and talk radio are to blame.

    and the worst part is that no one on this site is demonizing patriotic conservative for this language. shame on all of you who are still paying attention but not standing up when someone says reprehensible things.

  7. Patriotic Conservative says:

    What is a patriotic Conservative’s favorite holiday? The Forth of July. A religious one? Christmas. How about a back-stabbing Liberal’s? Nine-eleven.

  8. The Other Side says:

    fixing the debt isn’t as simple as turning off an engine or grounding a toddler…no matter what conservatives think. it goes back to the whole tea party ideology and how it doesn’t translate to actual governing.

    so we’re just supposed to ignore what bush did to ruin the country? well i guess so because if you just don’t think about how conservative policy fails every time its used, you can come back two years later and try the policies again.

    so obama caused the deficit that started when bush was in office? or obama’s policies deregulated the markets to where it collapsed the economy? or obama started two wars that weren’t on the books to affect the deficit? or whose tax cuts aren’t creating jobs and are raising the deficit? yeah, its always obama’s fault and policies just shift to the next president. and blaming the media who shows john mccain and michelle bachmann whenever they can is soooooo librul.

    and the reason why we can’t forget about bush is because the failed policies of the 2000s are being raised again. tax cuts don’t work. privatizing ‘entitlements’ was a bad idea with social security and will be for medicare too. if your forget about history you’re doomed to repeat it and for republicans to still think they are right about policy will to serious harm to america.

  9. Castor says:

    Its a lot of other people too, Bames. Bush gets way too much credit for bad things and Obama gets way too much for good things. Who is responsible? The media.

  10. Bames Jond says:

    Blah blah “republicans don’t care about anything, bush tax cuts and wars cause everything bad to happen to America, democrats wanna save the world”

    Jeez dude, thats like the entire premiss of every argument you give.

    the government is spending more money than a 7-year-old in a candy store with a visa credit card. how does one stop the child? you ground him. send him to his room

    you know, yes. the npr thingy was a stupid thingy, but the planned parenthood? why do democrats offer billions of dollars of cuts in other areas so that republicans wont touch the hundreds of million in planned parenthood? i dunno, my theory is they’re obsessed with population control.

    And finally, let go of bush! hes out! done! gone! he cant do and hasnt done ANYTHING to hurt America next to the little elbow skinning he gave us near the end of his term. then obama comes in and breaks America’s friggin arm

    I for one am EXHAUSTED of hearing how bad bush was and that everything bad happened cuz of him when everything is still getting worse!

    but you know, thats just me. 😉

  11. The Other Side says:

    how is shutting down the government going to help bring down the deficit? is it going to roll back the bush tax cuts and end the wars in iraq and afghanistan? because thats where most of the deficit spending is going. and all this npr and planned parenthood defunding is pathetic. trying to get the base all riled up? that’s great for america.

    republicans don’t care about the deficit because if they did, they would have done something when bush was president. its only a deficit crisis when a democrat is in charge.

  12. Castor says:

    You’re totally right and I agree and support that notion.

    In order to fix an old car, you have to shut off the engine first.

  13. The Other Side says:

    i’ve been on this site for a while and have had many debates. just because i annoy you doesn’t mean i’m trying to be a nuisance.

    and yes, you have made your views quite clear and have no reason to do what i want. there is no room for growth in those views or any movement towards an understanding. and that’s why the tea party is going to shut down the government.

  14. Castor says:

    I believe the reason you keep posting is for the sake of being a nuisance. Otherwise you would post on a more serious sight thats actually MADE for debate.

    Also I’ve already told you my views, therefore, I have no more reason to fulfill you’re “enlightenment”.

  15. The Other Side says:

    castor, i haven’t reassured you of anything, you would’ve thought the exact same thing no matter what a liberal said. and my response assures you how every liberal in the world reacts to a joke? you’re not looking for any other reason besides liberals take things too harshly.

    and if that were the case, why am i still posting on this site? there are posts that i don’t like but i don’t need to comment on everything. i just read them to learn about how some conservatives view an issue them move on. and most of them aren’t worth a response.

    this site has had some intense debates, which are really interesting, where the posts aren’t meant to be humorous. saying that someone can’t respond seriously to a comment because this site is “a joke blog” is an excuse for you to not engage in a debate. and that’s why i’m responding to you now…because i’m interested to hear your point of view. you’ve enlightened me on the tea baggers’ personality and politics.

    i agree that comedy is very important, but its not an excuse when convinient.

  16. Castor says:

    Nobody ever said repulicans were perfect (by the way, it was a typo, i didnt notice until now). In fact, they’re far from it. But in my opinion, they are the lesser of two evils. My comment was meant as a joke. A test, if you will, just like my one on the other topic with chuck glisson.

    You have simply reassured me that liberals take things much too harshly. I can stand a conservative joke, but when liberal jokes are made, it seems as if you think we are attacking people directly. There’s nothing wrong with a bit of comic relief in one’s life, in fact it’s healthy not to take things so sharply.

    After all, this is a joke blog. You know, joke? Funny? Haha?

  17. The Other Side says:

    “these day” liberals are always bad and republicans can do no wrong. everything evil in the world is because of liberals. the us is in ruins because of only the actions of liberals. that seems like a very reasonable world view.

  18. Castor says:

    Yeah, um bayou… I understand what you said. Do you?

    Because personally is sounds as if you resorted to the “synonym” function in MS word.

    Finding “untainted ground” is near impossible these day, but i respect the idea since all the tainted parts are on the Democrat’s side of the floor… feel free to quote that.

  19. Buck says:

    Hey Bayou,
    HOGWASH! I see you took the time to put together some big words into incomprehensible sentences. Unfortunately the points you actually do make are wrong. Forget your first paragraph…doesn’t even make sense.
    Yes, political discourse is shrill. Nature of the beast as it always has been, we just have better, faster and more widespread communication so it seems worse. I completely disagree about the sense of community and civic engagement. The Tea Party seems pretty engaged. The Wisconsin unions seem pretty engaged. Discourse is ramping up because fundamental differences are butting heads over how best to govern in difficult times. Conservative vs. Liberal could not be more clear.

    A country founded on pamphleteering? The constitution is a pamphlet? Give me liberty or give me death. Yeah, I guess when they came out with the T-shirt, it just caught on.

    And last but certainly not least your true colors shine through with your reference to the WASP agenda. Okay Farrakhan…loosen your bow-tie…the blood is not getting to the brain. (Notice the double entrendre)

    (EDITOR’S NOTE: Meeting of the WASP Agenda Committee is tonight at you know where. PASSWORD is Purity.)

  20. Bayou says:

    Well, I’m glad THAT’s over.

    Shall we start again?

    The structure of the enfranchising process perpetuates the rabid partisan rhetoric that all of you are guilty of- so its not your fault- you just want to believe something so badly that you will latch onto anything that comes along, regardless of how ridiculous or impractical it may be.
    American political discourse has become so shrill, that now the public philosophy by which we live cannot secure the liberty it promises, because it cannot inspire and sustain the sense of community and civic engagement that liberty requires.
    But what do you expect from a country founded on a political tradition of pamphleteering? When in doubt, shout. And the louder you do, the more it demonstrates the true insecurity of your own beliefs- since you clearly cannot expose them to critical scrutiny or engage in a values debate without ad hominem attacks.
    There was a time when independent thought was valued, but it certainly has not been in my lifetime. I challenge you all to rise above this petty squabbling and find whatever common ground remaining that has been untainted by the WASP agenda.

  21. The Other Side says:

    how do you propose that we find 12 million people who know that they’re here illegally and don’t want to be caught? your idea isn’t practical…just like many tea party ideas.

    find me where democrats are trying to take away your second amendment rights…please. because that is a baseless accusation about democrats. and why do tea partiers care so much about the second amendment but not many other ones? and you totally discount the bush administration’s actions again. its a pretty immature argument to be like “bush did this, but democrats are worse.”

    the us chamber of commerce is very far right. why would they donate money to democrats? they gave $2 million to the rubio campaign and $1.2 million to the paul campaign. they spent $30 million on ads attacking democrats. the chamber advocates for tax cuts, lower taxes on profits, repealing wall street reform and are against unions. what political ideology does this sound like?

    why has the debt increase under obama? where did most of the deficit come from?

    ok, show me every liberal protest and every assassination threat and then you can make that claim. but you’re being hyperbolic right now. again, you resort to saying that liberals are worse instead of defending the actions of far right wing kooks.

    so only republicans can stay in this country? you prove my point that only liberals can be labelled un-american. you say that liberals are ruining america? what proven/factual/tangible evidence do you have of that claim? look at the country after republican control…there’s your evidence that republican ideas do not work.

  22. Castor says:

    So you’re saying that integrating all of the illegals into our population is more acceptable than deporting them as they should be? They are illegal! They are mooching off of our economy, sending money back to their countries, or putting no money into the cash flow whatsoever. They need to be sent back to their countries… or the moon. Whichever works.

    Bush violating an ammendment is different from the democrats trying to erase an ammendment. They want to implement government run gun control, and that means they would have to violate the 2nd. Therefore, they are trying to repeal it instead, just to make it lawful.

    No, I’m sorry it was my mistake, he was using his campaign money to attack his opponent, but the dems also use outsourcing ads funded by the chamber of commerce to attack republicans, especially near the past election.

    Dude, google “cbo cost of stimulus package” then see what comes up. The cbo IS the congressional budget office, so I think it would be in your best intrest to trust them…

    From 1980 until 2008, the debt rose from 3 trillion to 8 trillion. Thats 5 trillion over the course of 28 YEARS. In just 2 years, democrats have surpassed that. 2 years vs 28. They are spending over 200% faster than the republicans were.

    I do agree that church and state should be separate, and I do believe that creationism should not be taught, but I DONT think that it should be ousted by the educators.

    You’re telling me that Bush had no assassination threats? There were threats against Bush at EVERY liberal protest in his terms.

    “and now that that people are complaining about a democrat, liberals somehow still need to leave america. whats up with that?”

    Because liberals are ruining the country. If you love leftist ideology so much, then go to england or france.

  23. The Other Side says:

    trying to solve illegal immigration is a very complicated task…that’s why immigration reform hasn’t been accomplished yet. but do you think that america can just deport the 12 million illegal immigrants? again, thats entirelly idealistic but not at all realistic. there needs to be a path to citizenship because it would be impossible to locate then deport everyone.

    i can’t effectivelly defend obama’s internet policy because i don’t know anything about it. but it is interesting how you totally discount the bush administration’s disregard for the 4th amendment. but you of course are freaked out about anyone touching or mentioning the 2nd amendment.

    in the example you provided, was the money attacking the republican from the chamber of commerce? because ads attacking democrats totalled in the tens of millions of dollars.

    i thought we could trust the numbers provided by the cbo because it was a governmental organization? google ‘cost of stimulus package’ and before even looking at any of the links, the ny times mentions that it costs about $838 billion. and the cbo says “cbo and the staff of the joint committee on taxation (jct) estimate that enacting both pieces of legislation will produce a net reduction in federal deficits of $143 billion over the 2010-2019 period.” that means that the health care bill would not add to the debt, but would reduce the deficit. where do you get your numbers?

    where were the national debts at the beginning of reagen, bush 1 and bush 2’s terms and where were the debts after they left office? the debts were all much higher. there are charts of wikipedia if you search under the national debt. and the budget was balanced under clinton, he gave bush 2 a surplus which was turned into a defecit.

    the debate over religion in schools will always be around. but the 1st amendment provides a seperation of church and state. as a result, no one should be praying at school, even the muslim you mentioned, nor should there be any teaching of creationism.

    what have democrats done to take away 2nd amendment rights?

    the emotions of the tea party can, if escalated enough, lead to violence. politics is something that stirs up such strong emotions and if certain people are fed factless conspiracy theories, they can do damage. thats why the tea party movement is dangerous: uninformed people who are fueled by anger. why is there such a spike in the militia activities and threats of assassination on obama?

    and your final statement is telling. i was told by people on this site to leave if i don’t like the way america is being run. and now that that people are complaining about a democrat, liberals somehow still need to leave america. whats up with that?

  24. Castor says:

    I’m glad that you don’t support illegal immigration, but you and I both know that one of the profound democratic policies is to implement amnesty to illegal immigrants. And dems are busy putting together a new amnesty bill for illegals, so don’t say they don’t support it.

    “so obama wants to police the internet for potential threats and you take that to mean that he wants to control the internet? i wonder what you think of the bush administration using the nsa to spy on america?”

    Bush’s using the nsa to monitor America is a domestic action. The internet is world wide, and the bill clearly states that the government would be able to access and or edit online private data without cause. In short, if they think that they should control the internet, then they will, giving them worldwide influence.

    You said that the money is not being used to attack republicans? What about Vincent Sheheen’s campaign against Nikki Haley? Constantly mudslinging about how she’s a whore and such. He even made several unproven accusations against her about supposed affairs she had.

    Might I point you to this chart? The chart that shows a sharp spike in the climb of the national debt after 2008?

    Where on EARTH are you finding any infomation that the national debt increased by 5 trillion dollars under bush? I can find it no where. And the cbo itself stated that the stimulus was 3.27 trillion dollars and that the health care bill costs over 2 trillion. With the power of simple addition, even the most dull human can see that it adds up to more than 5 trillion.

    Yes, ok? I HAVE read everything you have said. Quite simply, I think it’s funny. Because you clearly cannot grasp that the democrats are bigger attributers to the deficit than republicans, despite overwhelming evidence. Yes, America did have a deficit. America has ALWAYS had debt. The country had a debt of 5 trillion after World War 2, and 8 trillion from 2004-2008. THEN, from 2008 until now, it hopscotched to 13 trillion like a little girl on caffiene.

    Quite frankly, no. I can’t defend the man stepping on the woman’s head. But liberals can’t defend the healthcare (MoveOn) activist who bit off a 65 year-old man’s finger at a liberal rally, or the disgrunteled liberal who punched a man at a tea party, now can they? I’m not saying that any amount of wrong’s on either side make a right. But there are MANY more incidents of violence at liberal rallies than at tea parties. And by the way, Miller himself claimed that the man aggresively approached him.

    I have liberal teachers in my school quite clearly claiming that religion is flawed. I being a christian, am forbidden from parying at lunch, but a muslim boy at the next table is permitted to, democrats are doing everything they can to create gun control and repeal the 2nd ammendment, and my teachers also say that the concept of Creation is incredibly flawed.

    NO! I am not defending a revolution! I never even hinted that! I am merely saying that the people of the country will end up so frustrated, so outraged, that that’s what it will come to. I don’t want to result to violence, I don’t want civil war, and most CERTAINLY, I don’t want to CONTROL the country.

    I have an undying love for America. And if liberals have a problem with the way the country was when it was founded then THEY should leave.

  25. The Other Side says:

    washington is broken, you won’t get a disagreement from me. but its not possible to switch everyone out at the same time.

    you’re kidding me, you actually think that i support illegal immigration? i don’t think you do. what i do think is that you need something on the democratic side to create a false equivilancy. you cannot defend shipping american jobs overseas so you attack liberals for something that they don’t advocate for. and mexican immigrants work jobs that americans won’t do, so its not taking jobs away from americans. however, when a corporation outsources jobs to china which takes jobs from americans, thats indefensible.

    so obama wants to police the internet for potential threats and you take that to mean that he wants to control the internet? i wonder what you think of the bush administration using the nsa to spy on america?

    true, the money in the chamber of commerce’s coffers could be used to attack republicans…but its not. you keep throwing out hypotheticals but don’t actually address what is actually happening.

    and i misspoke with the national debt…its not billions of dollars its trillions of dollars. and history has shown that the national debt increases more under republican white houses…look it up. and national debts increase when there are year to year deficits in spending. that means that america is spending more that it is taking in. why does the debt increase under republicans control?

    where do you get your numbers on the health care and stimulus bills? how does it cost $5 trillion? and how will health care not decrease the deficit?

    do you understand where the deficit is coming from? have you read what i’ve been writing about the deficit? can you see how the bush administration contributed to the deficit? how are the two wars and tax cuts that balloon the deficit obamas fault? look deeper into the numbers and you’ll see that obama already had a deficit when he was inagurated because of the bush administration.

    okay okay…enough with the media talk. how can you defend some dude stepping on a woman’s head? the video shows the man stomping on the woman’s head…that’s the important part of the story.

    the reporter at the joe miller ralley did not accost miller in the bathroom, they were in there at the same time. the journalist had the decency to wait until miller was in a better position before asking the questions. and miller’s thugs, who did not have a license, handcuffed the reporter for no reason. the police officer let the journalist go and charges were filed. where did you get the part about disorderly conduct?

    how are second amendment rights oppressed? how are religious rights oppressed? how is religious education oppressed? besides those issues…you can actually defend a revolution of the country? that’s treason. also, you can’t control the country with your policies so you resort to violence. thats what the tea party is all about: they can’t get what they want so they threaten violence. thats pathetic.

    and if you don’t like america, move. thats what conservatives told liberals during the bush administration. leave america if you don’t like it.

  26. Castor says:

    … No. I don’t believe that politicians are moral. That is the reason I say we need to switch ALL of them out. That’s what I’ve been saying so far. But where can yo find a democrat who voted in favor of something because of a donation? The republicans do it because they already believe that it’s the right thing to do.

    You argue that corporations should not ship jobs overseas, and yet democrats support illegal immigration so that illegals can get jobs in the US that belong to US citizens. There is no difference between to two. Both of them takes jobs from the citizens.

    “A pair of bills introduced in the U.S. Senate would grant the White House sweeping new powers to access private online data, regulate the cybersecurity industry and even shut down Internet traffic during a declared “cyber emergency. A working draft of the legislation obtained by an Internet privacy group also spells out plans to grant the Secretary of Commerce access to all privately owned information networks deemed to be critical to the nation’s infrastructure “without regard to any provision of law, regulation, rule or policy restricting such access.”

    Those bills give authority to shut down internet traffic and access private data. Case closed, they want to control the internet.

    If that money can be used for anything, then it can also be used to attack republicans as well.

    “the national debt increased from $5 billion to $9 billion under bush junior and from $2 billion to $5 billion dollars under reagan and bush senior.”

    Yes, but in this insance we are speaking of an average of 7 billion dollars here. Compared to the 5 trillion dollars that the democrats raised? Oh yeah 7 billion is waaaay more right?

    Oh, and to be blunt, no. You are misinformed. The actual cost of obamacare and the stimulus DO add up to 5 trillion dollars. The health care bill will not decrease the deficit. And even if it would, it’ll be repealed right when republicans take office.

    Oh, I’m sorry, did not NOT see any charts of the national deficit? Every graph I’ve seen has the debt slowly climbing to 8 trillion, and then in 2008, it starts SKYROCKETING towards 13 trillion. 2008, yeah I’m pretty sure that that’s when obama became president right? You can’t blame everything on the republicans.

    Rand Paul did get out of the suv you know. Why was she let go? Because she played the victim! The liberal media took that story and then twisted it into a giant knot of BS. They just needed an oppurtunity to tell people how violent the protests are, so they doctored an event that was actually provoked by a liberal.

    Joe Miller is a teapartier. And that journalist was a reporter for a liberal news site who followed him into the bathroom and accosted him with questions. He was arrested for disorderly conduct.

    Unfortuantely, that it was it will come to in this country. If the continued oppression of gun rights, religious right, and conservative educaton goes on, I fear that there will be an uprising. This country needs retribution. And I know it’s coming soon.

  27. The Other Side says:

    politicians are bought and sold on both sides. the money that is polluting our democracy is on both sides. but i just can’t believe your naivity about how crooked politicians are. you really think that they stick to their morals when money is involved?

    there is only one side to shipping jobs overseas…that the jobs need to stay in america. if there are no jobs in america, then how can people afford to pay the lower prices? you are on the fence about americans losing jobs? really?

    net neutrality, that’s what i was talking about. media companies are wanting to make people pay more to access certain websites. and the two bills that you gave were for the administration to monitor for cyber attacks. turn down the paranoia just a tab because not everything that obama does is to limit our rights.

    the us chamber of commerce is taking in money from foreign donors and placing the money in the same fund as it uses to pay for political attack adds. money in that fund is used for many reasons but the fact that the money can be used for anything means that it can be used to attack democrats.

    and castor, your lack of understanding of the economy is astounding. the national debt increased from $5 billion to $9 billion under bush junior and from $2 billion to $5 billion dollars under reagan and bush senior. its not about specific bills, its about the yearly deficits. the stimulus costs $838 billion and health care reform costs about $1 trillion. but the stimulus only added to the 2009 deficit and the health care bill is going to reduce the deficit over the next 10 years. so not only are your numbers of the democratic bills way off, but your analysis of the national debt is mis-stated. look up the yearly increases in the national debt and you’ll see that republicans are mostly to blame.

    there is video of the woman having her head stomped on, you cannot refute that. and the video before the assault showed the woman flashing a sign at the suv with rand paul in it. how was she supposed to attack paul who was in an suv? if she actually attack paul, why was she let go? why is she not being sought by the police and why is the man who stomped on the woman’s being sought by police?

    why was a journalist handcuffed at a joe miller rally? why are tea partiers saying we need to keep insurection “on the table” and we might need to use “second amendment remedies?” because the tea partiers are emotional and irrational.

  28. Castor says:

    Unless that politician is for the policies that benefit oil companies in the first place, why would they vote for them? You’re telling me that if a majorly liberal candidate recieved millions of dollars in campaign money that they would vote in favor of it? No. If they truly believe that their views are correct then they wouldn’t. Oil companies tend to donate to republicans because republicans are in favor of off shore drilling anyway! You’re saying that the companies can buy democratic votes? So are you implying that they are materialists and don’t stand up for their own views if presented the right price…?

    Over seas labor is certainly a contreversial subject, and I tend to look into both sides very critically. For instance, if a company uses labor over seas, then they are giving jobs to other countries that rightfully belong to the citizens, but then again, over seas labor tends to be cheaper. This means that the companies can afford to lower their prices and make their products more affordable for American citizens. I personally am on the fence about that topic and don’t take either side.

    Nowhere, in ANY source of information can I find how corporations want to limit the internet. And what do you have to say about bill numbers S.773 and S.778? The one’s that will give the government and the president to rights to control the internet? The ones that are being pushed by DEMOCRATS?

    If republicans are supposedly recieving money from unknown sources, how on earth do you know about it? Can you name any instances where this has happened? Do you have a copy of the GOP funding documents? No, I don’t believe that you do.

    Name 3 bills that the republicans will implement that will out-spend the democrats.The accumulated debt over America’s lifespan is about 13 trillion dollars. The stimulus bill costed 3.27 trillion dollars, and obamacare costed 2 trillion dollars. Thats 40% of the national debt RIGHT THERE. It took from the end of world war 2 til last year to gather 8 trillion, and in one year alone, it jumped by 40 percent. And you still say that the republicans out spend the democrats…

    If the amount of money is so unknown, how do you know about it? How do you know how much it is? How do you know it’s even significant enough to matter?

    Oh, no. Nonononononoooo hahahaha. You really did NOT read into that event enough. Lauren Valle, the supposed “victim” of an attack at one of the tea parties, was a PAID activist of who stalked and LUNGED at Rand Paul. She tried to attack him! She even got up and started talking after the people in the crowd subdued her, but just to make herself appear innocent, she faked injury and the leader of Moveon claimed she was in the hospital and that they were awaiting word from her. She is also a convicted FELON who was caught and charged with nauthorized entry of a critical infrastructure, unauthorized entry of an inhabited dwelling, and vandalising the SS Harvey Explorer while it was docked in May of this year.

    So, even after all the violence conducted at liberal rallies, you can only point out something that, in fact, was not even a premeditated incident at all. If this is your best story, then that’s just pathetic.

  29. The Other Side says:

    according to the citizens united supreme court ruling, corporations are considered private citizens. thats why they can now put money into elections like citizens can. the difference is that companies have millions or billions of dollars.

    castor, how naive are you about money in politics? do you really think that when a big oil company donates money to a politician, that that politician doesn’t vote in favor of policies benefiting oil companies? why would an oil company donate to that specific candidate if they didn’t benefit them?

    corporations control the message that is being destributed to america. they control the wealth that pays for influence in congress. they control the jobs that either stay here of get shipped over seas. companies want to make money and will do anything to make that money, which means controlling politicians. why do you think they got tax cuts? or why republicans filibuster bills to keep jobs in america or prevent giving loans to small business? why are regulations being slashed slowly by congress that is being paid for by companies? why do many companies avoid paying the taxes that they should be paying? why would they want to control what is on the internet? corporations have the power and influence to actually affect america…

    …unlike acorn which has virtually no impact. just see what happened when congress erroneously cut their funds. they went bankrupt. and it is a false equivilency to compare the money that democrats and republicans get. democrats normally get money from unions who are getting less and less influence because corporations are removing jobs. republicans are getting money from corporations and unknown donors that are going through third party groups like karl rove’s pac and the us chamber of commerce. and republicans are out spending democrats 7 to 1 this election. it doesn’t matter how many places a party gets money from, the main point is how much money they are receiving…and republicans are receiving significantly more.

    why aren’t you upset about the amount of unknown money being pumped into this election? isn’t that destruction of democracy important to the tea parties?

    finally, did you see that rand paul supporter attacking that woman from and you say that there is no violence in the tea parties?

  30. Castor says:

    You talk about the big corporations like they are single people who have accumulated billions of dollars. Corporations are made up of millions of employees, so the wealth there is not as concentrated as so many big-business hating people believe. True, the heads of those corporations are mostly millionares, but unless they won the lottery, then they EARNED their money. Just like the average person should EARN their money.

    And just how do corporations control part of the country? Politicians control the country, politicians. The corporations may send money to endorse certain political campaigns and such, but they have no influence on the policies which are voted on. And large corporations like Pepsi and Coke have provided hundreds of millions of dollars for liberal causes such as gay rights, so why do liberals turn around and order money from them?

    Finally, how can you say that it is wrong for republicans to be supported by corporations, when organizations such as the jeremiah group or acorn (as it was) openly supported democratic nominees and even engaged in voter fraud?

  31. The Other Side says:

    castor, your ideas are ideal, but not realistic. our current american system favors the rich and neglects those in need. companies are getting tax cuts or using tax loopholes to not pay their fair share while the poor are struggling. why are corporations allowed to make billions of dollars in profit while simultaneously shipping jobs overseas? and then why are they allowed to spend unlimited amounts of money to buy this election? with their vast wealth, corporations have a significant control of the country.

    to blindly support companies that are destroying america is why i’m frustrated with the tea party. you are being used by groups like america for prosperity and freedom works to get republicans elected. those republicans are being supported by millions of dollars from unknown donors that are making a mockery of the democratic process.

    and the tea parties are supporting these republicans who represent corporations, not the average person. that blindness is mind numbing.

  32. Castor says:

    Thank you.

    And I never said that I bear no care for people in need. What I believe is that liberals misinterpret ways in which to help these people. Instead of simply giving them a handout for not working, why not limit the amount of time that they are allowed to be on welfare? My idea is that if a person is unemployed then they should be able to apply for unemployment for a maximum of 3 months before being cut off. This would make them HAVE to seek out jobs.

    The flaw with this prospect is that if that individual cannot find a job in that time frame, then they’re pretty much screwed, but then, the flaw with limitless welfare is that they could simply stay on it for as long as they want. There in lies the impass between policies.

    I also believe that the needy should be able to do whatever they want, but I also believe they need to work hard for it.

    I can find no evidence of people being excluded from one of Bush’s conferences.

    Furthermore, I am doing the best that I can to answer your questions. If you don’t apreciate the views I am stating, I really don’t care.

    Here is what the tea partiers believe:

    The government has become more enthralled in maintaining its own power than satisfying the majority of America. Almost EVERY politician in office needs to be swapped out. We are tired of having our religious views criticised while others prosper. We are tired of being TOLD to be “green” while politicians fly their private jets, consuming tons of fuel. We are tired of left wing extremeists calling American soldiers evil and murderers. We are tired of having increasing amounts of our hard earned money taken from us. And we are tired of the overall political BLINDNESS of America.

    What we want in office is not a condecending politician who thinks he knows all the answers and exactly what America wants. We want someone who represents us as a people. We want someone who can relate to us as average Americans.

    When I said that liberals dodge questions, I did not mean you. This is what liberals do: take quotes out of context to pin it against themselves to act like the target.

    Once again, I did not refer to you when I said my last comment. Look at some of the liberal media channels. See how they make fun of Bush and conservatives as being stupid or rednecks who marry their cousins. They call glenn beck a nazi and rush limbaugh an overweight disgusting blob (even though he’s lost plenty of weight).

    And yes, I did call you names. It is immature but then again, I’m at the age where it’s acceptable to be immature anyway.

  33. The Other Side says:

    i’m sorry about your aunt. 9-11 was a terrible tragedy in america that has affected people in many different ways.

    i want you to explain your position because they seem so poorly thought out and illogical. like, you have an obvious double standard about liberals (they need to follow the will of america but not republicans), you think its okay to let the wealthy do whatever they want but don’t care about the needy, you just said recently that democrats were in office when republicans were, and even in your last post you say that democratic press conferences were planned but don’t mention how people were thrown out from bush’s apperances (and remember how planned those health care town hall meetings were and how easy it was on liberals?). your mindset is so emotional and lacks so much critical thinking that i want you to have to actually explain and think about your positions. you can’t just throw out talking points and not expected to be asked to explain your positions.

    remember, i want to learn about what tea partiers think. and not agreeing with a position does not mean that i don’t care about it. why would i still be on this site if i didn’t care what you have to say?

    when do i not answer your questions? when i’m explaining positions like the economy, the iraq war, congress, torture, 9-11, view of muslims, health care… and this is what tea partiers do well: distract and force liberals to play defense because they can’t win debates on merit.

    and when have i called you a name? you’re the one who keeps calling me names even though you say its immature. so who’s the hypocrite here?

  34. Castor says:

    To answer your question, yes. My aunt was on the street in New York when the towers fell. She was engulfed in the debris and required medical attention.

    What I want to know is, why do you want me to explain my position further, if you clearly don’t care about it? This is what the liberals do as well. They also can’t answer questions when called on, that’s why the press conferences are all carefully planned, so that they can only let in people who will ask easy questions. And when they ARE called upon to answer a question which they don’t know the answer to, they stutter and dodge it.

    And I try not to resort to name calling, I agree, it’s immature. But liberals do it too, so don’t be a hypocrite.

  35. The Other Side says:

    i seem to have hit a nerve by mentioning 9-11. lots of emotions. why the personal response? do you know anyone who was directly affected by 9-11? because your knee-jerk reaction to anything said by a liberal about 9-11 is extreme. and you’re not listening to me, i’m not saying in cold terms that victims of 9-11 need to ‘get over it.’ i’m saying that working through the trauma will help their quality of life. but you’ll still think that i’m not compassionate and anti-american.

    and you could probably tell that i work in mental health because i said that i work with people who have been through trauma and that i’ve mentioned the mentally ill. nice.

    but to your point, i’m not trying to use reverse psychology on you to convince you that i have a point. i’ve given up on trying to change your mind on anything…continuing to believe that i can change your political views is arrogant and naive. i’m trying to get you to actually explain your positions instead of shouting out mindless catch phrases and calling you out when you’re diverting from the debate.

    this is what the tea partiers do, when called on to provide more information, they get emotional and resort to calling people names. why is it so hard to stay on topic?

  36. Castor says:

    Oh and I can also tell that you are a psychologist because you’re using psychological jargon and reverse psychology to try and make me convince myself that you actually have a point. Let me get one thing clear, I’ve taken 2 years of psychology AND sociology so I know and I’ve read about the things you are doing. Don’t always assume that you are the smartest guy in the room.

  37. Castor says:

    Abuse abuse abuse abuse WHAT ABOUT MURDER HUH?! You ever worked with anyone who was in one of the towers while it fell?! Do you know anyone who has?!

    Let me answer for you, NO! Otherwise you show actually show a hint of compassion!

    You people make me absolutely sick! You tell me to be compassionate about welfare, then you say that I need to get over 9/11!

  38. The Other Side says:

    oh…my…god…i work with people who were raped or prostituted when they were children. i hear about child abuse, spousal abuse, drug abuse, verbal abuse by parents to children. i see the results of actual past and present trauma. i have experienced trauma in my own life along with viewing trauma in my family. get off your high horse.

    if people continue to hold onto what happened in their past’s, they will struggle and that trauma will control their lives. trauma can be processed and the stress can be coped with…that’s what i was talking about. therapy and medication are effective in getting people back to functioning the way they were before the trauma. that’s what i do every day at work.

    but the larger issue here is that i call you out on your mental processes and you redirect it back to me. why is there such resistence in introspection? and to call me heartless…that’s amusing after hearing your utter hatred for islam and your apathy towards those in need. it almost seems like you are putting your heartlessness onto me. i take the trauma in my life and transform that knowledge for good. i have worked through what has happened in my life and it is liberating. you use your trauma and spread hatred and ignorance. why are you so afraid of your own psychology?

  39. Castor says:

    Go around to every household, every child who lost a parent, every husband who lost a wife and vice-versa, every person who became permanently injured… go around and look them in the eyes and tell them to get over it.

    You are a heartless being.

  40. The Other Side says:

    comparing muslims to nazis is pejorative. there is a difference between a political ideology and a religion.

    traumas happen every day that deeply impact people. the reaction from the victim or those affected is very significant and emotional. and emotions do not allow for rational processing of events. it leads to irrational beliefs and anger. which seems like exactly the reaction you are having. because you run on the primative parts of your brain, you get stuck into a mindset of pure reaction without higher level functioning.

    until you can get past the emotions of 9-11, you will never be able to form a well-reasoned view of islam.

  41. Castor says:

    Not all Nazis believed in the murder of the jews, but people aren’t called out for generalizing there, are they?

    And many of those things do happen in America, they just are not the resluts of American society, more often they are the result of the country not caring. What about that incident with South Park threatening to make mohhamad appear on tv? The event caused an attempted bombing in New York. Good thing the muslim was too stupid to work his bomb…

    You clearly haven’t been through what me and all the other people who were directly or indirectly affected by 9/11 have been through. You can’t just turn away from something like that.

  42. The Other Side says:

    there are many flaws to islam…many bad people, bad beliefs and bad laws that are being practiced. i don’t agree with muslims who literally freak out when a picture of muhammad is published. i don’t agree with the treatment of women in islam. i don’t agree with the rigidity of not opening churches in islamic countries. but many of those things happen in middle eastern countries…not in america. and they are cherry picked examples of the negatives of islam.

    america is better than those countries. we hold ourselves to a higher standard of tolerance because its morally right and we are morally superior.

    my point is that not all muslims believe in those very rigid dogmas. just like not all christians believe that you should kill abortion doctors or that the apocolypse is coming. there will be extremists in every religion…but they do not represent the entire religion.

    why spend so much time hating something? aren’t we told to “love thy neighbor,” and “turn the other cheek?”

  43. Castor says:

    you took two negative experiences with islam and generalized them to represent an entire religion.

    I did not.

    These two events started my attitude towards them. Once again, after further research, I gained the knowledge that I have of islam and then it simply escalated.

    Are you telling me, that after reading all of the information, that you still see no problem with it? Because I would think someone who thinks as critically as yourself would find plenty of things wrong with islam. But no, instead liberals see that everything should revolve aound tolerance.

    While we have thousands of mosques in the US, but if we were to attept to open a christian church in an arabic country, we would be stoned. Who is really the intollerant group here? Islam.

    To be honest, no. There isn’t anything about islam that I respect. Everything good about them that I have found on pro-islamic sites, is simply contradicted by facts that I see on non-partisan sites.

    You want to forgive and accept them. Have you ever heard the phrase “give that man a hug, and he’ll stab you in the back”?

    And why is it that when a popular tv show shows Jesus Christ in a vulgar sense, nobody cares, but when it is even HINTED that mohhamad will appear on television, the entire country goes into an uproar? Why do christians get the short end of the stick?

    England expressed acception. Look at them. Islam has overrun England to the bone. There are mosques on almost every street corner.

  44. The Other Side says:

    you went through two events that were emotional and dramatic. fair enough, it sounds like it affected you a lot. both events were very emotional and were significant to your life. but, decisions made based on emotion are not entirely rational. you are tying negativity about islam to your neighborhood and family which stirs a lot of anger, hatred and concern about your community. but does that mean that its warranted?

    you took two negative experiences with islam and generalized them to represent an entire religion. but not all muslims are violent or dangerous. in your research, have you always seen islam through a lens of hatred? because that isn’t going to allow you to see any contrary evidence. can you say anything good about islam? is there anything about islam that you respect?

    if not, then all it seems like your doing is finding more and more to hate about islam. that stubborn mindset is what is feuling those who do want to see bad happen to america. they see americans as intolerant of their beliefs and calling them terrible things. and that’s what they use to inspire others to join their cause.

    so why don’t we take away a significant recruiting tool and show that we’re better than they are? that we can forgive and accept them even though they wish us ill? continuing to hate will just perpetuate this ugly cycle. why are you chosing to focus on hate when there is so much good in the world?

  45. Castor says:

    I have neighbors who work at a gas station around my corner. They are muslims. We had them over for dinner one night, and the topic shifted to an uneasy subject, jihad. My mother asked what would happen if a jihad was called in the United States, they said that they were muslims before they were Americans and that they would join the jihadists in elliminating Americans. These were people we thought we trusted.

    My brother’s 11th birthday was also on 9/11. He saw the news on that day, and he was never the same. He cried himself to sleep every night for weeks and he vowed that he would join the military to fight them.

    I hated to see him that way, and I don’t ever want that to happen to anyone ever again.

    So those are the MAIN reasons I started hating Islam, but upon further research I grew continuously more and more loathsome towards the “religion of peace”.

  46. The Other Side says:

    i see you are as charming on that site as you are on this site.

    so you hate an entire religion? you think that you are superior to another set of people and find only negative examples to support your position? that’s bigotry.

    i’m no example on islam and you have a lot of examples to support your point. but i just can’t get past the fact that you have such a hatred for something. it almost seems irrational how much work you put into spreading hate about something. why do you spend so much time researching the negatives of islam?

  47. Castor says:

    I would type out all this information, but since I already have on another site i will just redirect you:

    I started commenting on post #10. Read all of the information I post, look it up, read some of the responses. I have and undying hatred for islam and it will not go away anytime soon.

  48. The Other Side says:

    “Islam…is the monotheistic religion articulated by the Qur’an, a text considered by its adherents to be the verbatim word of God…and by the teachings and normative practice of Muhammad, the Prophet of Islam.” from wikipedia. what would you call an organized group of people that follow a sacred book and worship to a diety? i would call that a religion. islam is a religion practiced my over 1 billion people; what’s your beef with them? true, they have extremists, just like christianity, that engage in terrorism. but that does not reflect the mindset of the majority of muslims, just like with christianity. most muslims are peaceful.

    “The word “mosque” in English refers to all types of buildings dedicated for Islamic worship.” also from wikipedia. the park 51 project is a community center with a prayer room and is not dedicated for purely islamic worship.

    i agree that the building of the community center near ground zero is contraversial, its not illegal. there were prayer rooms in the world trade center and the pentagon. what is so insulting?

  49. Castor says:

    That muslim prayer site right next to a 9/11 memorial is an insult. And what do you think a mosque IS? It’s a muslim prayer space.

    Yes the bill of rights guarantees freedom of religion, but… it’s too bad for the followers of islam, because islam, contrary to popular belief is NOT a religion! It is an ideology, like budhism. So technichally, we can deny them anything we want.

  50. The Other Side says:

    ok, castor, i understand that you get your information from many sources. but when all of those sources support your far-right wing ideology, how well informed is your position. and again, if you look for something you will find it. and you obviously want to find that there is going to be a mosque near ground zero. so you look at sites that support your pre-conceived notion. however, that does not mean that your position is well informed.

    have you read about what is actually going to be at the old burlington coat factory site? the islamic center “includes a 500-seat auditorium, theater, performing arts center, fitness center, swimming pool, basketball court, childcare area, bookstore, culinary school, art studio, food court, September 11 memorial, and Muslim prayer space that would accommodate 1,000–2,000 people.” from wikipedia. now where does it say that this site is dedicated for worship, which is what a mosque is.

    why can’t the park 51 supporters build a center near ground zero? and if it is about the fact that they are islamic, why does that matter? doesn’t the bill of rights guarantee freedom of religion? or does that only refer to christian religions?

  51. Castor says:

    Anti community center?

    Man, I’ve been on several muslim chatrooms, and all the speakers refer to it as “the mosque at ground zero”, so shut up about that.

    Abdul Faruk wrote a book in arabic claiming that the mosque was a major stepping stone in the stealth jihad in the united states.

    Theres this thing called research. It helps.

  52. The Other Side says:

    i think you missed the point castor. i was referring to defense spending; that funding of which no one can reduce. so reducing the inefficiencies in the defense spending means reducing that spending. can you argue with that?

    i was not referring to spending to stimulate the economy. that is very affective spending. its about the context of the conversation and i was talking about the defense spending.

    you might not fear that the terrorists will kill you, but you’re playing into their hands by disparaging their religion with the anti-community center rhetoric.

  53. Castor says:

    “the reason why the spending isn’t effective is because many times it is being wasted.”
    Precisely my point this entire time, thank you other side.

    Hahaha and I don’t fear terrorists, I pity them for their idiotic beliefs.

  54. The Other Side says:

    nice name calling castor. that really helps your credibility.

    but to your question, reducing spending on defense will not decrease our safety. as we have seen from the bush years, our defense spending has increased but our safety has decreased. so there is no correlation between increased defense spending and increased safety.

    the reason why the spending isn’t effective is because many times it is being wasted. independent contractors get paid with no-bid contracts that waste money. removing troops from iraq and afghanistan will also reduce spending. our anti-terrorism department is running so complicated that it is wasting money without aquiring meaningful intelligence. there are more inefficiencies that can be found to reduce the spending without decreasing the quality of the security.

    how much does america spend on national defense? $663.8 billion. that is the largest spending in the budget, about 23%ish. we spend about 40% of the world’s military spending.

    that is a lot of spending on just one portion of our economy. and to conservatives that is untouchable? so medicare, social security, and government spending are the only things that can be cut? if conservatives are serious about reducing spending, they need to have all budget options on the table.

    but the main point is that castor is scared which means that the terrorists have won. by no means am i diminishing the threat of terrorism, there are people out there who hate us and would love to kill americans. but having no flexibility on defense spending is not realistic. we can save money without decreasing safety.

    is that a good enough answer?

  55. Castor says:

    If you want America to be strong then why do you want to cut funding to the military and national defense?
    Answer that, jack****.

  56. The Other Side says:

    how do liberals hate america? how do liberals want to make america “one of the weakest nations on earth?” there are no answers to those questions because they aren’t true. just more baseless accusations.

  57. Castor says:

    Oh, don’t forget they want to see America as one of the weakest nations on Earth…

  58. Blastmaster says:

    Liberals… so f****** stupid.. like lambs to the slaughter… they WANT gov’t running everything… they HATE everything American while reaping benefits that she provides… Idiots will never learn… And they will NOT be happy til they are praying to Mecca 5X daily… either that, or running scared saying the same things conservatives have been saying forever… but it’ll be too late… To paraphrase Sarah Palin… How’s that ‘hopey/changey’ thing working out for ya?

  59. Kaiser says:

    J.K. Rowling, the bestselling novelist and the first billionaire author, never attended college.

  60. Kaiser says:


    Regarding Rush Limbaugh… you ask “what kind of patriot wants his president to fail?”. That’s from a while ago, and if you haven’t

    “almost all billionaires are democrats”. Like who? Warren Buffet is the only one that comes to mind.

    “to be a billionaire you need to be educated”. Not true.
    Bill Gates: high school diploma.
    Warren Buffet: high school diploma.
    Lawrence Ellison: high school diploma.
    Li Ka-Shing: high school dropout.

    Others have done extremely well without higher education. Thomas Edison was home schooled. George Washington never finished elementary school. Ray Croc, founder of McDonald’s, dropped out of high school.

    JFK dropped out of Princeton. Andrew Carnegie the industrialist didn’t finish elementary school. Michael Caine, the Oscar-winning actor, dropped out of high school.

    Even John D. Rockefeller Sr., history’s first recorded billionaire, stopped going to high school, only two months before graduation.

  61. Nick says:

    When will people start to realize that BOTH the REP and DEM parties are corrupt and inept. Neither side would even know how to ACTUALLY change a lightbulb. They would just argue about who is responsible for breaking it, and how much money can be thrown at the light bulb to prevent this from ever happening again. But the bulb would remain broken.

  62. Stephen Johnson says:

    Do you know what Christopher Columbus problem really was? He went by the writings of the catholic’s Apocrypha. Proof in point…We all know that water verses land is 70-30. Read the Apocrypha that was written in Christopher Columbus’ day. It clearly states that land verses water is 50-50. Proof that the Apocrypha has nothing what so ever to do with God’s Word. Now read John 17:17 and Psalms 12:6-7 from the King James Bible.

  63. annon says:

    On the abortion issue;

    It seems all liberal think that if we are pro-life then we want women who have been reaped to be forced to carry the child. I believe that if there is a serious condition in which the mother could lose her life, or if she had gotten pregnant from a rape then she should be allowed to have an abortion. On the other hand, i highly disagree with abortion being used as a birth control. I could care less about the person’s age, enthnic background, political party, et cetera. The simple fact is, abortion is a MEDICAL PROCEDURE, not a form of birth control. It should only be allowed in cases of proven rape or if the mother will die.

  64. Doug says:

    Okay I have a few groaners for you…

    How many liberals does it take to change a light bulb?

    Well, in order to change the bulb they have to vote for change. After they vote to change the bulb, they have to create a bureaucracy to actually do it.

    What is the difference between a liberal and a wimp?

    Being a wimp is not voluntary, being a liberal is.

    When does a liberal know better?

    When he is being whipped by his politically correct hermaphrodite.

  65. notmyrealname says:

    nathan you are very mature for your age, i very must agree with you. the immature comments are what got me mad in the first place. seriously if there were more conservatives like you this would be a better place. oo and im 4 months shy of 17 :) cant wait to get my full license!

  66. notmyrealname says:

    stephanie, you need to [*]. most rebuplicans act like they arent educated not liberals. the way they talk just shows they have no manners. rush limbough is the perfect example. what kind of patriot wants his president to fail? and fyi almost all billionaires are democrats, and to be a billionaire you need to be educated.

  67. Nathan, A 17 year old kid says:

    You know, as hard as it may seem to be nice to liberals (I’m a hardcore conservative), the immature attitude that many of us conservatives have on this site is shocking! I personally hate almost all of the views of liberals because of my morals, but that doesn’t give me any excuse to start cussing them out without explaining HOW they are wrong. You’ll never get anywhere in life if you just get angry over everything and diss the other side! (By the way, I appreciate all the MATURE comments by both liberals AND conservatives on this site)….And a lot of the jokes WERE kind of funny….
    …So my advice is, diss Obama (and other liberals) MATURELY, so that they will also listen to you :)

  68. Multiracial republican says:

    i hate democrats they are all self-hating whites

    democrats create racism and they are trapped in seeing people by their race. they are stupid.

  69. The Other Side says:

    republicans are hiding behind the soldiers again in response to the new dhs report of right-wing threats.

    and why have the posts on this site gotten angrier? when bush was in office we had conversations based off of facts and opinions. now its “f*** every liberal who ever wrote on here.”

  70. hates obama says:

    f*** every liberal who ever wrote on here

  71. Kaiser says:

    Okay, everyone, stop commenting right…. now.

    Thank you. These are getting too long and the internet is not the best place for debating. The anonymity is the major problem.

  72. The Other Side says:

    conservatives have an affinity for hiding behind the soldiers when attacking liberals. its a lazy arguement. if you don’t agree with my point of view then get out of america. why don’t the conservatives who don’t agree with obama get out? same arguement.

  73. Jessica says:

    Pro America, I agree with you 100%. Liberals are so ignorant.

  74. Pro America says:

    F*** YOU gun grabbing liberals! What would George Washignton say to you freedom snatchers?! You want to destroy everything our soldiers have fought for. Liberal’s arent for the death penalty when it comes to murderers, but they think its okay to murder a fetus who has done no harm to anyone. Oh! and marriage is between a man and a woman only! If you liberals are so unhappy with “true” american’s fighting for this country, then why don’t you leave! If you want socialism so bad go to a country that practices it. OH, and Obama’s ratings are worse today than Bush’s were at this time in 2001. Idiots!

  75. Flu-Bird says:

    Q.How many liberals dose it take to change a lightbulb? A.None their still grouping around in the dark their used to it

  76. Kiwi says:

    I love the jokes, but I hate the angry comments that follow. JOKES, people!! And Stephanie is also a joke for thinking republicans are poor. HAH! All the poor people I know are liberal hippies and oddly enough all the rich people I know are republicans. How does that work out for you Stephanie?

    I am loving the jokes, by the way.

  77. Jim Mukubansky says:

    Labels don’t mean anything anymore. The only ones who still use them are the right-wingers.

    (What’s funny about that? I voted for Clinton, then Gore, then Kerry and now I’ll vote for Obama. I am an avid reader of the New York times and the Washington Post. I don’t see the humor in that supposed “joke.”)

  78. CBOE says:

    liberalism is a mental disorder

  79. Hawaii says:

    It is well known in medical circles that liberals only have two working parts.

    the Mouth and the Rectum,

    And both are interchangeable…..

  80. Andrew says:

    um responding to zoot potatoe, there’s nothing worse then a liberal since you can’t spell.

  81. John says:

    I am now aware that I reposted the joke about the puppies. I blame George W. Bush somehow.

  82. John says:

    These jokes are great! Though I myself am about as conservative as Dick Cheney is steady with a rifle, here are one for each party!
    Q: What is the difference between a liberal and a puppy?
    A: A puppy stops whining at some point in it life!

    Q: What do Rush Limbaugh and the Hindenburg have in common?
    A: They are both flaming Nazi gasbags!

    If your liberal or conservative and you can’t take a joke, shame on you.

  83. Jimbo says:

    Definition of a liberal.

    A liberal is a person who will give you the shirt off from someone else’s back

  84. Troy says:

    The Ant and the Grasshopper
    by Jim Quinn

    The Original Version

    The ant busts his ass in the withering heat all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter. The grasshopper thinks he’s a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away. Come winter the ant is warm and well fed. The grasshopper has no food or shelter so he dies out in the cold.

    The New Liberal Version

    It starts out the same but when winter comes the shivering grasshopper calls a press conference and demands to know why the ant should be allowed to be warm and well fed while others are cold and starving. CBS, NBC, and ABC show up and show pictures of the shivering grasshopper next to film of the ant in his comfortable home with a table filled with food.

    America is stunned by the sharp contrast. How can it be, in a country of such wealth that this poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer so? Then a representative of the NAAGB (The National Association of Green Bugs) shows up on Night Line and charges the ant with “Green Bias” and makes the case that the grasshopper is the victim of 30 million years of greenism. Kermit the frog appears on Oprah with the grasshopper and everybody cries when he sings “It’s Not Easy Being Green.”

    Bill and Hillary Clinton make a special guest appearance on the CBS evening news and tell a concerned Dan Rather That they will do everything they can for the grasshopper who has been denied the prosperity he deserves by those who benefited unfairly during the summer, or as Bill refers to it, the “Temperatures Of The 80’s”.

    Finally the EEOC drafts the “Economic Equity and Anti-Greenism Act” RECTRO-ACTIVE to the beginning of the summer. The ant is fined for failing to hire a proportionate number of green bugs and having nothing left to pay his Retro-Active taxes, his home is confiscated by the government.

    The story ends as we see the grasshopper finishing up the last bits of the ant’s food while the government house he’s in….which just happens to be the ant’s old house…. crumbles around him since he doesn’t know how to maintain it. The ant has disappeared in the snow. And on the TV; which the grasshopper bought by selling most of the ant’s food, Bill Clinton is standing before a wildly applauding group of Democrats announcing that a new era of “Fairness” has dawned in America.

  85. Deeranged says:

    You’re a joke altogether… exceptions apply (mainly sad ones)

  86. I strongly HATE the last one! this is a place for republicans not donkeys

  87. lp says:

    liberals are retarded. stop trying to change this country around. we’ve been around for over 200 years & we haven’t failed yet so why complain about every single thing that is going on. stop trying to fight everyone & help everyone out. the reason people aren’t as success as others is because they’re liberals. deal with it.

  88. The Other Side says:

    if you flip-flopped your beliefs during Clinton, what are you thinking now Bush Lover? you changed your whole political beliefs based on someone’s character? haven’t you noticed the character of Foley, Lott, Ambramoff, Allen and Rumsfeld? one man has an affair and you now are Republican. what does it take to flip back to Democrats? apparently not pedophilia, scandals, racism or an impossible situation in Iraq. political beliefs are stronger than you seem to make them.

  89. Bush Lover says:

    Ok, look. I want to say something to Suzanne.

    Yes, Jesus was Liberal.

    And I’ll say, many Liberals were good people.

    JFK, Andrew Jackson, Roosevelt.

    But After Roosevelt, liberals started screwing up.

    Accepting gay marraige, stem-cell research. Flip-flopping.

    So, in the past, Liberal was good, in fact, I was a liberal myself prior to Bill Clinton. After I saw the scum-bag Bill Clinton was, I change to Rep. And im a republican.

  90. British_Nationalist says:

    Apologies but you seem to have misunderstood my meaning, Kolran. I do not deny that the light bulb joke is poking fun at and ridiculing the Bush Administration and some of its (as I see it) faults. Rather, I was responding to LetsCUBoxMe’s statement about my contradicting myself, to which I can only reply that a JOKE is not meant to be a rational, well thought out and water-tight argument. There will always be loopholes and contradictions in a piece of humour, as by its very nature it conflates, exaggerates and satirises what is really going on.

  91. kolran says:

    Of course it wasn’t it was just titled “How many members of the Bush Administration does it take to change a light bulb?” That clearly has nothing to do with bush or any of his administrators.

  92. British_Nationalist says:

    Ah, but this joke was never really intended to be a direct and calculated attack on Bush per se (I’ll save THAT for another time). It was just a bit of satire depicting some specially picked areas of said President’s premiership.

  93. LetsCUBoxMe says:

    Highly amusing. However, during your brilliant light bulb retaliation you contradicted yourself terribly. If you were using actual events and headlines circulating around the Bush administration, which I suspect you were, you first attack said light-bulb-changing administration for denying the light bulb needs to be changed and THEN attack the administration for changing the light bulb.

    I’ve noticed this a lot lately (among Republicans)… People who were all for the war are now saying what a horrible thing it is and such. Lots of Republicans who actually haven’t flipped on the war subject have flipped on their opinions of Bush. First they think he’s a wonderful president, then he’s a danger to our great and utterly confused nation. Iiinteresting…

    Oh and another little observation that doesn’t pertain to this by any means — have you ever noticed how the opposing party always becomes an insult of the highest nature. Suddenly its a “stupid democratic computer” or he’s a “liberal idiot” :)

  94. Buck says:

    Brittish Nationalist is obviously a bleeding heart, Bush hater….but the light bulb thing is pretty good.

  95. British_Nationalist says:

    Q: How many members of the Bush Administration does it take to change a light bulb?

    1. One to deny that the light bulb needs to be changed.

    2. One to attack the patriotism of anyone who says the light bulb needs to be changed.

    3. One to blame Clinton for burning out the light bulb.

    4. One to organise the invasion of a country rumoured to have a secret stockpile of light bulbs.

    5. One to give a billion dollar, no bid contract to Enron for the new light bulb.

    6. One to arrange a photo shoot of Bush, dressed as a janitor, standing on a step ladder under the banner: Light Bulb Change Accomplished; and all before the light bulb has even been put in.

    7. One administration insider to resign and write a book documenting in detail how Bush was literally in the dark.

    8. One to viciously smear #7.

    9. One surrogate to campaign on TV and at rallies how Bush has had a strong light-bulb-changing policy all along.

    10. And finally one toconfuse Americans about the difference between screwing in a light bulb and screwing the country.

  96. Buck says:

    Dear LetsCUBoxMe,
    You must of have been pissed because that was a heck of rant. I agree with a lot of what you said, but not everything.

    Our government is indeed screwed up in a lot of ways, but by and large, it works.

    I think there are plenty of people in politics who say and do things as a matter of principal, Republican and Democrat, liberal and conservative alike. Not everything is pure politics. I think George Bush makes a lot of decisions because he feels like its the right thing to do.

    You are dead right about one thing. Arguments about the issues of the day should be based on facts and to a certain degree opinion. Name calling and blathering on in generalities just reveal that your argument doesn’t have a lot to back it up.

    I think its okay, sometimes, to talk in general terms about some groups because sometimes its true. So if the facts back it up, generalities are okay.

    Thanks for being a part of our ongoing debate. I hope you’ll be back soon.

  97. LetsCUBoxMe says:

    Oh! I thought of somethingn else!

    *ignores groaning*

    There have been a few posts talking about the children of liberals. What is that supposed to mean??????? Argh! This is a subject very close to home. Children do not have to believe what their parents believe. It does not work like U.S. citizenship — just because your parents are republican does’t by any means make you a republican! I go to a Christian school and only about 10 kids know anything about what we all debate about. They just listen to their parents, make points they’ve heard other say, and refuse to think for themselves because… well — that would just be too hard!

  98. LetsCUBoxMe says:

    Okay…. wow… just wow.

    I couldn’t even make it through all these comments. I stopped reading at the 10th illiginimate argument. So lets see… where to begin…

    I must admit there are a good deal of totally valid educated arguments in here from people from BOTH PARTIES who know what they’re talking about. Then there are all the rest. The ones who contradict themselves, call people idiots while they themselves just learned how to spell the word, and know absolutely nothing about the topics they so firmly believe in.

    However even in the good legitimate arguments there are many many many awful, ugly, horrendous generalizations. Everyone does it. Don’t deny it. EVERYONE. Democrat, republican, liberal, conservitive, marsian — they generalize about everyone else.

    Quoting the Bible here (no I’m NOT a conservative) – “Don’t worry about the speck of dust in your neighbor’s eye while you yourself have a plank in your own eye.” Thats not an exact quote. And please don’t ask me where it comes from. I don’t pretend to be a perfect Christian because there’s no such thing and if there was he (or she) would be as far from politics as possible. The government is pretty screwed. There is no arguing with that. That is not to say that I don’t love America, its just the truth.

    Another thing that all parties are guilty of:
    Simply discrediting their opponents in anyway possible. I think I remember a few arguments of this sort when I was in kindergarten. You don’t use facts. You don’t use sense. You just say that anyone who doesnt’ bellieve what you do is stupid. How mature of us all.

    If u missed it that last was dripping with sarcasm.

    Also, those who swear and use vulgur language to describe the supposed low IQ of others are only proving their own low IQ. There are plenty of good words in the English language and you don’t need to result to vulgur ones to make your point. If you DO in fact need to result to swearing you have an incredibly miniscule vocabulary and I will keep you in my prayers.

    Ooh! And another thing!
    If you ignore all else please think about this.
    I’m sorry to be the one to tell you — but our president and our governers do not tell us their reasoning. They do not tell us what is REALLY going on. They do what is politically correct and what will get them votes. Who needs morals? Or integrity for that matter? If your in a campaign it doesn’t matter anymore. We are not informed of their true reasoning behind things. If you go by what you read in the news paper and what you see on CNN you are incredibly misinformed and should not be drawing any conclusions. What Bush claims are his reasons for going to war with Iraq most likely are only on the very surface. Our political heads do not speak for every single individual in their party and you need to grasp that concept before you make claims like “every liberal is stupid” or “every republican is old fashioned”.

    This leads me to another point… I have so many. Most people have probably fallen asleep by now but I’m so angry right now I don’t really care.

    Why must we sort people???? I believe someone called it racism in the earlier posts. Its a very close resemblance. Why do humans have the need to box everything and everyone??? Maybe you are part liberal part republican part green. You cannot box everyone so neatly as you would like. Deal with it and as I said waaaaaaay at the top stop generalizing.

    Okay I think I’m done now.

    For now at least…

    I’d like to see legitimate arguments for what I’ve said. I promise I won’t disreguard anyone but if you call me a “dum libral” I may slap you.

    To err is human.

    And I think everyone discussing is human… but its not proven.

    Ah, one last thing. The jokes way back at the top before I got angry — very amusing. Both liberal and conservative bashing. I don’t agree with a lot of the views but humor is humor. 😀

  99. Red King says:

    Republican= American
    it is funny because the libs will blame everything that is bad happens is Bush’s fault. ‘global warming'(fake) is Bush’s fault ‘if Sadam loses a case’ it’s Bush’s fault.

  100. nutslikebush says:

    Surely you must see that your claim that my rejection of your superstition is evidence for its validity means that you and I simply cannot reason together. We cannot agree upon reality and have no common channels through which we can genuinely commmunicate. I am thankful for the small number of people who went beyond superstition and used science as a method for establishing an agreed upon reality. Those people moved us out of the Dark Ages where disease and disorder were seen as curses and into a place where we can understand more about the fundamental reality of the world we live in. The modern world is built on science. Unfortunately, though you depend on it, you do not understand it. Most americans have very poor scientific educations. That is a formula for disaster.

  101. McSpankerton says:

    Sir Nuts,

    Once again you’re diving headfirst into the crosshair by trying to pick apart every single tid bit and analyze ’em. That’s great, but you can only argue so much against Joy. She spelled out free will like a pro. She also has apparently done her home work on the book of Genesis and God’s relationship with man. You, being a “Biblical scholar” should know that (like i’ve said) you’re fulfilling prophecy when you reject it. It doesn’t say why people would reject the Gospel but it does say they will-so the reasons just happen to be twisted logic, skepticism, etc.

    P.S. That’s great that you read the Bible over and over, but it apparently never penetrated your heart.

  102. nutslikebush says:

    I don’t see the good of having someone die (human sacrifice) for a relationship. Certainly a wise god could come up with a far better plan. Heck, I could come up with a better plan than the one I read in the Bible. I have read the Bible many times (cover-to-cover; 15 straight years, once per year). The problem is, I actually thought about it a little too much and it started seeming absurd. Then I started studying biblical history obsessively and learned as much as I could about the ancient people who produced the Bible. Then it seemed even more absurd, but I think I understand why they produced what they produced. I now am a person who essentially accepts the essence of christianity (do unto others as you would have them do unto you) but I don’t buy the superstions of the ancients. I do think that the pull of the cognitive illusions is very strong though – almost irresistable (notice I said almost). I have always been a magnet for extremely religious people – the ones who know me are perplexed. How can someone be so nice and so smart (and humble) and not be a Christian, they always ask. It takes practice. My spiritual soul-mate has published an essay that captures much of what I believe about god at this site. You may find it interesting.

  103. nutslikebush says:

    As you all know, the “Homeland Security Act” (who makes up these names?) passed. What does that mean for us regular joes. Visit this website and see for yourself.

  104. Joy says:

    Hi Lefty,
    Regarding comment #58; I agree – a god like you described isn’t worth serving. That description, however, doesn’t happen to fit the God of the Bible, as you may know.
    From what I see, God made mankind for a relationship with him. Genesis says that He walked with man in the cool of the evening…not He had man report to Him and barked orders. Since no relationship is real without the choice to stay or leave – mankind was created with free choice. When the choice was made by mankind to go for one denied thing rather than enjoy the hundreds of free priveleges, the consequences came….and yet, the same One who had to follow up with consequences, provided covering for the people. The Bible shows God as demonstrating, through the laws He gave, what it would take to try humanly to meet the standards necessary to become perfect again…yet no one could or can continually meet even one of them (read “almost never”), let alone all of them. Surprise surprise. Therefore, He began the example of taking unblemished firstborn lambs to be offered as a sacrifice for “missing the mark” of perfection (sin). Why did it matter to be perfect? Because less than that cannot be in the presence of absolute perfection and live…and God wants us in His Presence – in relationship with Him. These lambs were only a representation of Jesus, God’s perfect first (and only) born who would live to show God’s heart to us in a way that we could begin to get it (He said that all the Law was summed up in this “You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might, and your neighbor as yourself”)…and who would die willingly in our place so that we could receive, through faith, His payment for our sin and, therefore, have a full relationship with the Father. He is the only perfect One Who could pay the price that fulfills the demands of justice with the mercy of the Father’s heart.
    Regarding torturing people brutally for all eternity:
    As you must know from your Bible reading, hell was made for other creatures, not humans. The only humans who go there have chosen to do so by default in not accepting the Gift of LIFE given when Jesus took our place and punishment.
    Don’t we all like to do anything we choose that feels good without having consequences?:like eat poorly yet stay in good health; not exercise and yet stay in shape; have multiple sex partners yet have no emotional pain or physical disease; spend and save the same money;…yet, in order to get the positive results we want, we need to fulfill our responsibility…our part in the equation.
    From what I see, it’s the same with a relationship with God. God has paid the price necessary to restore a relationship with us…now it’s up to each of us to personally reach out from where we are to say: “Help me know You for Who You really are”
    In my experience and from what I see in Genesis through Revelation, domination is not what God is about.
    Relationship is what I see. Relationship, responsiblity, and reality.
    One last comment at this time, there is no place that even remotely insinuates that the ‘true believers’ will have anyone under their thumbs…perhaps you were ‘inhaling’ while listening to a Rolling Stone song during Bible reading? (heh heh…a little humor there)
    If I inherit my dad’s estate, it doesn’t put it under my thumb, but in my care.
    Perception makes the difference.
    From what I see, God is about dominion (a healthy control,not to be confused with domineering), security, responsibility and mercy.
    Another view to consider.

  105. Thanks everyone for all the comments. Just a note from the anonymous unseen force lurking behind Laugh at Liberals to all that we aren’t approving comments copywritten material without permission from the authors. It’s perfectly okay to submit small excerpts with sources cited. If you have a lengthy post, you may want to submit as an article. Also, we usually don’t approve long lists of links. Thanks again folks.

  106. nutslikebush says:

    I stumbled across your comment on free will. The options you present seem like the opposite of free will. Your god says “bow down before me or I will torture you brutally for all eternity.” That reminds me of the sort of tyranny (Saddam, for example) that I hate and want to rid this world of. I would also like to rid people’s imaginations of a god like that. I believe such a god is a domination fantasy that weak people use to say to themselves; “you just wait! One day we will get you under our thumbs. We (the true believers) will dominate you and control the world.” It is the psychology of weakness and repression.

  107. Jack Antilla says:

    Emory, read the “truth about the mid east” post on here, Thats where I covered U.S funds to help the Afgan Gurillias during the soviet invasion.

  108. nutslikebush says:

    Now that I have put some information in your hands, the burden is on you to show me where the factual errors are in this case. I look forward to reading your critique and seeing your sources.

  109. Emory says:

    McSpankerton, you may have just made a mistake asking Nuts for links :) IHMO, you might ask him to prove his claim and see what he comes up with. That way the burden of proof is on the person who makes a claim like that.

    It seems like we’ve already discussed how the U.S. funded the Afghan Mujahadeen in the 80’s to overthrow the Soviets. I don’t recall anyone demonstrating that funds went to Arabs fighting in Afghanistan and certainly not to bin Laden.

  110. Jack Antilla says:

    why don’t you be a good little school boy and stop reading idiots like sean hannity.

    you want my opinnion read the wikipedia articles i provided in “the truth about the mid east”

    I know he lied, but get this he lied about somthing that was privite while other politicians today both democrat and republican lie frequently and often about things that are very public matters.

    oh shocking isn’t it?

  111. McSpankerton says:


    Please provide a link that proves “Reagan spent billions of taxpayers’ money to help him build his army”. That is a FALSE CLAIM!!! You just have nothing to help your argument, so you’re pulling a Michael Moore with your propaganda crap.

  112. jimbear says:

    In my opinion they all suck,,well maybe not Reagan… but the rest suck..if any of them fed, state, or local gave a crap about the people here we wouldn’t have the homeless, or people needing food ,or needing medical care..and we wouldn’t be letting other countries tell us what to do..

  113. Tony22 says:

    Why don’t you read some books and find out that the sudanese did offer him to be taken with plenty of evidence showing what he had done. If bill had felt like it, he couldv’e locked him up. Read let freedom ring by sean hannity. why don’t you read it likea good little schoolboy. And his name is already tarnished because of all his lying sprees jack

  114. nutslikebush says:

    The problem is he’d have to report for duty first. He has a pretty bad track record in that respect.

  115. Emory says:

    Something in my gut tells me if Bush were behind the the joystick of a predator and bin Laden’s face popped on the video screen, he’d would press that button.

  116. nutslikebush says:

    I read the link that you provided. Then I read the next link which is very informative too. It quotes Condi Rice actually making counter-points to the ones that you like – she said that the Bush administration didn’t use the Predator against bin Laden because there were too many problems with it and no one wanted to take the blame if something went wrong in the attack. So it appears that the G.W. Bush made exactly the same “mistake” that you accuse Clinton of making. It is easy to try to stack up evidence that you like. But the evidence that you don’t like gets ignored, doesn’t it?

  117. Emory says:

    Truth detector! Truth detector!

  118. nutslikebush says:

    Remember, Reagan created bin Laden.

  119. nutslikebush says:

    Reagan and Bush 1 had plenty of chances to get bin Laden too. Instead they sent him billions of US taxpayer dollars to help him build his army.

  120. Emory says:

    Jack, it’s not right wing propaganda that president Clinton had opportunities to get bin Laden. There are many reports detailing the different instances. Here is one report from (liberal) MSNBC source.

  121. Jack Antilla says:

    Tony, don’t by into rightwing propaganda, clinton did not refuse bin laden on a silver platter.

    after the us embesy bombings you may recall this but he organized an international commitie dedecated to cuting off any assets linked to al queda, furthermore, he signed an executive order offering a large ransom for the capture or murder of Bin laden, he also organized a missile attack in sudan to kill him. and get theis, im not sure if you remember this either, but when Suddam steped out of line in the sanctions imposed by the U.N, he sent in a large strike force of B1-b lancers to bomb iraq.

    don’t tarnish the name of president clinton untill you do your homework like a good little school boy.

  122. Tony22 says:

    Clinton reduced the size of the military by almost half, refused osama bin laden on a golden platter and yes, squirted on his secretary and at least 1 to 2 other females. Clinton is no-one to look up to and anyone who defends him is blind to the facts.

  123. Tony22 says:

    Democracy was founded on facts, not opinions. So the news is fine but i don’t want to hear ted kennedy or any other stupid liberal spilling his eneducated heart out with opinions instead of using TRUE reason and unopinionated facts against us. i just dont want to hear it from them.

  124. righty says:

    Jack… I recall Mr and Mrs Clinton spent 50 million dollars of Taxpayer money obstructing Justice. I guess he did fight the republicans in that sense.


  125. Jack Antilla says:

    Righty, If you may recal, Clinton fought with his republican congress ALOT.

    He used his veto, and used it often.

  126. righty says:

    Lefty… Here are the facts since the Clinton Socialization Plan for American Healthcare (The day conservatives started punching themselves in the groin, as you would suggest)

    1994 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES
    1996 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES
    1998 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES
    2000 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES
    2002 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES
    2004 Election Poll – WINNER CONSERVATIVES

    FACTS Suggest the conservatives ARE WINNING YOU “DONKEY” (Pardon the Pun)

    Looks like the last real democratic idea (Socialism of Health Care) was their last idea for a reason. With the ABSOLUTE SLAM DUNK SPANKING IN EVERY ELECTION SINCE, I dont blame them for not sharing their idea.

    HINT: The Liberals have Ideas, the problem is the ideas SUCK and enough people are smart enough to know it.

    ANOTHER HINT: The only semi-successful democrat in 10 years was Bill Clinton. Wanna know why. He wrapped himself up in the Brilliant ideas of the 1994 Republican Takeover and worked with that congress to execute their contract with America.


    Got any more names to call me?

  127. Lug says:

    The Demwits have plenty of ideas??????????


  128. nutslikebush says:

    For someone who blows a lot of smoke about “facts” you have yet to actually present one. You sure you know what the word fact means? You come off as a brain washed hack, not a thinker who is interested in actually encountering reality.
    How about this for an idea – fix the freaking disaster we call the health care system. Or not, and just continue pumping insane percentages of your healthcare dollars into the mega insurance corporations. We had a chance to start repairing the system but idiots like you were suckered by the insurance lobby advertisements and the republicans in congress who are owned by the insurance industry into believing that taking care of each other was a bad idea – wouldn’t allow the super-rich to get richer fast enough. Never have people made a choice that was worse for them than when conservative zombies rallied against the best idea that could ever have been given to them, the Clinton Health Care plan. You guys screwed the pooch so bad on that and don’t even get it. Watching middle class conservatives operate is like watching someone punch themselves in the groin and think they are winning somehow. The next time you write that check for your family’s health insurance premiums take a moment and consider the irrationality of the current system (please don’t tell me that you are under-insured and that I foot the bill for you and my family too!). If the healthiest people shifted their health care insurance over to a more efficient heath care system we could do so much more for everyone at a much lower cost to everyone. Democrats have plenty of excellent ideas (civil rights, for example), but people who can’t think (e.g., you) don’t grasp ideas. It is in your DNA to only comprehend right-wing hate rhetoric.
    Yeah, and I’m sure you know Alito well – or did Rush tell you what to think about him? I seriously doubt that you know anything about him at all. And congratulations on your efforts to get an up-or-down vote on Miers, you hypocrites.

  129. nutslikebush says:

    Fox “News” has a broad viewship only because Murdoch insists that the reporters and anchors speak on an eighth grade level. I would bet that their audience is not highly educated and doesn’t read (other than the Idiot’s Guide series that is). The fact that the intellectually low acheivers (i.e., the left half of the Bell Curve) watch Fox News doesn’t make it worth watching. It breaks my heart that such trash can find an audience at all. Take a look at the quality of information and antidotes to the Mainstream Media that you can get on NPR (, or in magazines like Foreign Policy (, The New Republic (, The Economist (, Informed Comment ( or TomDispatch (

  130. righty says:


    I can see the Nuclear option being locked and loaded. WE WILL GET AN UP OR DOWN VOTE!!!

    Time for the right to take charge and run this country as they were elected to do.

    Welcome aboard Your Honor !!

  131. righty says:

    Again, NO FACTS. Everyone is suppose to just take the liberals word that Fox News is not news and that the only real news is the news that leans liberal. LOL. Good thing the country doesnt agree. For 10 straight years of Polls, they dont agree with you. This country is conservative and EVERY ELECTION SINCE 1994 PROVES IT.

    Here is a summary of what any IQ above 90 can take of the last 130 posts with you:

    All facts (including elections results) that prove this country is conservative are wrong and we should all take the liberal explanation for why its wrong even though it doesnt make sense.

    All facts about the CIA leak (NOT!) smear are true, even if they can’t be proved AT ALL and do not make sense.

    A baby becomes a human when it becomes wanted (in the eyes of liberals)

    We should become more and more liberal in order for this country to be prosperous (even though it’s history is CONSERVATIVE and we are the most prosperous country in history. AND, No other liberal/socialist society has ever been successful. EVER!

    The base of your party is a bunch of elitists who put all there faith in Man, the rest of your party (the majority of it) are followers, welfare, and those that are greedy for your promises of free government handouts.

    Until you look within your Party for the answers and come up with some ideas, you will continue to hand seat after seat over to the conservatives.


    Listen to your Honorable Bill Clinton, he agrees !

  132. nutslikebush says:

    This made me think of you.
    Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public.
    H.L. Mencken

  133. nutslikebush says:

    By the way,
    Isn’t it interesting that a rightwingnut talking point has become the line about liberals hating things. The right wing media practically invented hate and is completely fueled by nothing but hate. The only thing I hate on this planet is the stupidity of the far right (and I am not too fond of their ideological kin folk, the terrorists of the world).

  134. nutslikebush says:

    Fox News is faux news. It doesn’t meet a standard to be called real news. If you think that what most people like is quality, then your standards are pathetic. Most people like McDonalds and that’s shit too. That’s the point, what most people like is rarely the best. If most people like, beware because it probably sucks. If you actually believe that mainstream news is liberal, you are a nut. It is just mega corporations attempting to sell advertising. There is no liberal media, except in the imaginations of the right wingnuts who have brain washed you into being scared of your shadow. Happy Halloween – booo
    sorry, didn’t mean to scare you.

  135. righty says:

    Fact Check…
    The Maintream media is as Left wing liberal as you can get

    As far as conservative radio is concerned. YOU should be asking yourself why YOU opinions and the LIKES OF YOU are in the EXTREME MINORITY. EXTREME MINORITY.

    The facts are very evident when the LIBERAL RADIO NETWORK AIR AMERICA can not survive on its on. No liberal radio show is anywhere in the same galaxy as the worst of the conservative radio shows.

    The facts are evident that MORE people watch a balance new station (FOX News).
    In FACT, More people watch Fox News then watch CNN, MSNBC, and Headlines news (all the competion) COMBINED. YES COMBINED.

    You know why LEFTY… They dont want to her the Bull Dung, the HATE MONGERS, and the ANTI CHRISTIAN (Not Anti-Religion) that the left vomits.

    The Democratic Party has NO Substance, No Ideas. All they have is HATE. Your Leader BILL CLINTON just said so himself in the last 48 hours :)

    Its is so wonderful to be on the side of the TRUTH and the FACTS that support the truth.

    Keep repeating your lies Lefty, some people will believe but most have wised up.

    Bring on the most conservative constructionist judge on the planet. The left unarmed and prepared for defeat.

  136. nutslikebush says:

    When I am absolutely astonished that there are still people who allow themselves to be pulled around by their nostrils by the conservative media. Rush, Savage, Hannity etc. those guys are come off to intelligent people as being mildly retarded. Why in the world do people not just laugh them off the air? 100 percent of their callers should be pointing out that they are completely full of shit all of the time. But I guess that the call screeners would be fired if they let an intelligent critic ever get through and if one did, the host just hits the mute button when they sense defeat – at least that’s my experience.

  137. nutslikebush says:

    and Raw Story reported the following.

    Fitzgerald expands probe, believes he can get Rove on more serious charges, lawyers say

    10/28/2005 @ 2:22 pm

    Filed by Jason Leopold

    In one of the boldest moves yet in the 22-month investigation into the outing of a covert CIA agent to a handful of top reporters covering the White House, Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald is extending his probe and pursuing much more serious charges against senior White House officials, specifically President Bush’s Deputy Chief of Staff Karl Rove, lawyers directly involved in the case told RAW STORY Friday.


    While many people were left confused by news reports that said Rove wouldn’t be indicted Friday, the lawyers said that Rove remains under intense scrutiny and added that Fitzgerald is betting on the fact that he can secure an indictment against Rove on charges of perjury, obstruction of justice, the misuse of classified information, and possibly other charges, as early as next week.

    “This investigation is not yet over,” one of the lawyers in the case said. “You must keep in mind that people like Mr. Rove are still under investigation. Rather than securing an indictment on perjury charges against Mr. Rove Mr. Fitzgerald strongly believes he can convince the grand jury that he broke other laws.”

    The lawyers said that in the past month Fitzgerald has obtained explosive information in the case that has enabled him to pursue broader charges such as conspiracy, and civil rights violations against targets like Rove. Specifically, the lawyers said Fitzgerald is focusing on phony intelligence documents that led to the outing of Valerie Plame Wilson’s identity: the documents that claimed Iraq was attempting to purchase yellow-cake uranium from Niger.

    A court filing posted on Fitzgerald’s website last week was the first such confirmation that the prosecutor has in fact decided to pursue the broader claims that intelligence the Bush administration used to build support for the Iraq war was flawed and, as a result, the reason many officials inside and outside of the White House went out of their way to out Plame, whose husband was a vocal critic of the Iraq war who was sent on a mission to Niger to investigate allegations that Iraq had attempted to buy Niger from the African country.

    “On August 12 and August 20, 2004, grand jury subpoenas were issued to reporter Judith Miller and her employer, the New York Times, seeking documents and testimony related to “conversations between Miller and a specified government official occurring between on or about July 6, 2003 and on or about July 13, 2003, concerning Valerie Plame Wilson (whether referred to by name or by description) or concerning Iraqi efforts to obtain uranium.” the filing made by Fitzgerald last year states.

    NATO sources told United Press International Monday that Fitzgerald’s team of investigators has sought and obtained documentation on the forgeries from the Italian government.

    This claim, which made its way into President Bush’s State of the Union address in January, 2003, was based on falsified documents from Niger and was later withdrawn by the White House.”

    Fitzgerald will draw on another grand jury that is already empaneled. Federal law says that a grand jury’s term cannot be extended more than once, which is the case with the grand jury that has been hearing testimony in the case.

  138. nutslikebush says:

    I suppose you saw Blitzer’s interview with former CIA officer Larry Johnson. Here is the transcript that relates to you previous comments. Judge for yourself whether the CIA considered Val Wilson to be undercover (remember that NOC, non-official cover is the same as “undercover”. NOC agents do not hold a CIA passport when they travel overseas, i.e., they are non-uniform agents, spies, and if captured by a foreign government are in grave danger. This seems to have confused lots of talk show goofballs). Since her outing she and her family have been threatened by al Qaeda.

    JOHNSON: To that extent, I don’t know.

    But what I do know for certain is, we’re not just talking about Valerie Plame. We’re talking about an intelligence resource, a United States national security resource that was destroyed by these White House officials that went out and started talking to the press about this. Reckless. And they have — they have harmed the security of this country. They’re trying to pretend no harm, no foul, and find lots of excuses.

    BLITZER: Let me read to you from a Bob Novak column in “The Chicago Sun-Times” and other newspapers October 1, 2003, a couple of months or so after he revealed her name . . . That doesn’t make it sound like she was very covert.

    JOHNSON: Not only does — you know, Bob Novak once again demonstrates he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. And that is a lie.

    I defy anybody. I have got $5,000 that says that you can’t find a reference to Valerie Plame and the CIA prior to Robert Novak’s column. Can’t do it. The fact that she’s married…


    BLITZER: Well, why would Clifford May say that he knew about it?

    JOHNSON: Clifford May has been wrong on a whole variety of things.


    BLITZER: But he’s a respected guy, Clifford May.

    JOHNSON: Well, he’s respected by some people. I don’t respect him, because I…

    BLITZER: I have known him for many years… JOHNSON: I…

    BLITZER: … going back to when he was a reporter for “The New York Times.”

    JOHNSON: His information — his information — his information on this issue has been repeatedly wrong.

    And, again, I’ll bet Clifford May $5,000. Find the reference prior to Robert Novak’s column in which that information was out there. It wasn’t out there. Not only that. When Valerie wrote that check to Al Gore’s campaign as a member of Brewster-Jennings, she was living her cover. Not a single neighbor knew that she worked for the CIA.

    She protected that cover. She was in the process of moving from non-official cover to official cover, but, under the law, official cover still protected.

    BLITZER: Because there is some suggestion that she had been outed by other — by Aldrich Ames or others…

    JOHNSON: Well, my…

    BLITZER: … who were U.S. — were American spies spying for…

    JOHNSON: Sure.

    BLITZER: … the Soviet Union or other countries.

    JOHNSON: My understanding is that, as a result of the Aldrich Ames betrayal, the damage assessment there came up with the possibility that she may have been compromised, so she’s moved back to the United States, home-based here, but continues to operate from here, traveling overseas as a consultant with Brewster-Jennings. So, she was continuing to work overseas.

    BLITZER: What about the argument that she was driving in and out of Langley, CIA headquarters, on a daily basis for her job as an analyst in counter — nuclear counterproliferation?

    JOHNSON: People saying that just demonstrate their further ignorance of the CIA.

    At least 40 percent of the people driving through those gates every day are undercover. They are — sometimes, they are here in the United States for two or three assignment. Then they go back overseas. Their acknowledged relationship with the CIA is unacknowledged. They’re presumed to work for some other U.S. government agency. Their covers are backstop.

    So, just because they are driving through the gates there doesn’t mean that they’re not undercover. I was out there for four years driving through the gates. I was undercover until I day I left. And the only one who knew I worked with CIA was my wife . . .

    BLITZER: Were you surprised that, after her name was revealed, that she posed for pictures, that famous picture in “Vanity Fair,” that she posed for pictures elsewhere with her husband? . . .

    JOHNSON: Yes. With the benefit of hindsight, I don’t think Joe and Valerie would have done that again.

    But they also recognized, at the time when they did it, her career had been completely destroyed. And she had received death threats overseas from al Qaeda. So, as a result of that outing…

    BLITZER: How do you know she got death threats from al Qaeda?

    JOHNSON: I have heard it directly from people that have been told that there was a threat.

    BLITZER: Because she is a…

    JOHNSON: Because…

    BLITZER: … a former CIA operative?


    JOHNSON: … operative and outed by Robert Novak.

    There were three people that were identified as having a threat. And she was contacted by the FBI.

  139. nutslikebush says:

    Perhaps the problem is with your perception of today’s liberals and not with real liberals. I believe that your understanding of who we are is 180 degrees off and that in truth, the folks that your imaginary mental model of the modern liberal is a fiction fed to you by the conservative media blow hards. The right wing media has to create a wicked monster that they pretend to fight so they can scare you into listening to them (and the commercials that pay their multimillion dollar salaries) and they can pretend to be heros. They and you are fighting windmills though. You have no idea what a real liberal acutally believes. Adios Don Quixote.

  140. nutslikebush says:

    When Bush Sr. appointed Wilson to be a diplomat to Iraq before the first Gulf War, do you think that he was seen as a political partisan? When Wilson stood up to Saddam, faced him down, and single-handedly prevented Saddam from taking Americans in Iraq hostage days before the Gulf War that he was less than heroic? Bush Sr. praised Wilson’s diplomatic work in Iraq and even wrote to him after his NY Times piece was published to say that he agreed with Wilson’s piece. Wilson is the true patriot in this story and the right-wingers just want to do their typical character assasination exercise. You guys reflexively attack any percieved opposition instead of inviting intelligent criticism – that’s a major flaw and weakness of the conservative movement. If you don’t tolerate, and even invite, criticism you won’t discover the best answers.
    As for Wilson’s wife, everyone now recognizes that she was indeed a covert agent. That’s not even open to debate any more because it is an established fact. The energy company that she used as a cover was fictional too. She was a high level point person on WMD program in the CIA and the leak of her identity did IN FACT disrupt that program. The CIA must think that a law was broken when she was outed because it is the CIA who asked for this investigation. The investigation itself has been completely free of any signs of partisanship.

  141. nutslikebush says:

    TYPICAL of what the right does poorly – that is, THINK! You are just parroting the Rush Limbaugh and company misinformation. Look for some objective information on the matter and you will find that it conflicts with the story that Rush is telling you. You swollowed the crap that the right wing fools shoved at you without even chewing.
    Check your facts and you will quickly see that your sources are lying to you.

  142. Jack Antilla says:

    Wilson is not a “left wing cook” righty, in fact, in 2000 he donated a large sum of money to the Bush Campaign.

  143. righty says:

    Lefty (or AKA NutwhohateBush),
    Typical of what the left does well. You repeat lie after lie after lie after lie until enough people think its true. Notice what you said was statements, NO FACT WHATSOEVER.

    I will only address one of the lies because no one is really listening to this crap anyhow.

    Here are the FACTS on the Valerie Plame smear from the left.

    Valerie Plame, a CIA employee, and ex covert agent (she hadnt been covert in 5 years) is married to Mr. Wilson who happens to be a left wing kook who at the time was doing everything he could to take down the administration over the IRAQ War. His finding, when he returned was that IRAQ had not attempted to get Nuclear Material. That turned out later to be ANOTHER Liberal Lie repeated, and repeated. They actually DID try to get nuclear material but were unsuccessful. Where the “leak” that isnt a “leak” comes into play is that Judith Miller was researching it and in her questioning she asked who sent Mr. Wilson on his quest. The answer was, i dont know, ask his wife, she is CIA.

    There was NOTHING Illegal about any of it. It was all triggered by the left HATE GROUPS, which apparently you are a part of.

  144. nutslikebush says:

    Wow. This just in – “Cheney, Libby Blocked Papers To Senate Intelligence Panel” during the buildup to the Iraq invasion, Cheney hid intelligence documents from senate intelligence committees. Impeachment is too good for these clowns.

  145. Lug says:

    Nutslike bush….

    What a bunch of pabulum!!!!

    Ther’s a big difference between a “Classical Liberal” like Paine
    and the modern Lib kook of today!!!

  146. nutslikebush says:

    I am proud to be a liberal. Liberals, such as the founding fathers of our country (especially my favorite, Thomas Paine), Abraham Lincoln (a liberal republican) and before them, thinkers like John Locke and other prime movers of the enlightment. Have you noticed that the great thinkers and champions of human freedom and dignity throughout western history were usually liberals. I think it is pretty obvious, and sad, that the typical “conservative” in this country is uninformed (or misinformed by the information pollution that comes from the Limbaughs, the Moonie newspaper called the Washington Times (it really is owned by Reverend Moon you know. Why does Limbaugh always quote the moonie newspaper to make his points? That should just be embarassing), the White Supremicists who own propaganda magazines like American Spectator (check it out for yourself, they really are white supremicists and were Nazis during the 1940s. they funded the swiftboat lie factory too. bet you didn’t know that, unfortunately. It is hidden in plain sight. Just do a little research). The ‘Free Republic” is part of the effort to mislead and control you too. Practice a little critical thinking, Lug. Use your mind. All that we have in the modern world that is good, has its roots in the liberal thinking that emerged during the enlightment. Our founding fathers were educated in the liberal arts tradition of the enlightment. Follow their example. You and others who visit this site are probably good people, but your minds have become hosts for a virus (or, more properly, a ‘meme’) that is really hurting our culture and endangering our future. Sometimes I read what the conservative media is putting out and just think to myself, these people have not learned a thing since the 12th century? They missed out on the scientific revolution (and are brainwashed into believing weird superstitious nonsense), don’t understand that other species are barometers that give us direct information about the health of our environment (when they are driven to extinction, we won’t be far behind. Our fates are interwoven with theirs whether you understand that or not.) don’t understand western history (especially intellectual history), and don’t understand why we can’t conquer the middle east with a neocon crusade. Everything that your god, Bush, has attempted has turned out to be a catastrophic blunder (if you don’t see that, you are hopelessly brainwashed. Wolfowitz won’t get his utopia (even at a cost of hundreds of thousands of human lives and over $400 billion borrowed dollars so far) and we won’t even get the cheap oil out of this envasion that the administration had counted on (just another miscalculation, but who’s counting?). Our Vice President (emphasis on Vice) did hook his company up with about $20 billion in no bid contracts though – so perhaps there is a silver lining if you own Halliburton stock. The 50 or so covert CIA agents who used the same cover as Val Wilson (Plame) have lost that cover, an energy consulting firm, and have had all of their WMD intelligence and contacts compromised. So even the CIA is pissed at your people for their screw ups. The conservative media tries to tell you that democrats have something to do with the CIA leak scandal. But even that is a lie – the CIA asked for this investigation and it is entirely under the jurisdiction of the Dept of Justice. No democrats have any role whatsoever in the leak investigation. So the next time Rush or one of those other morons tries to get you to believe a lie, call them and tell them you don’t appreciate it. Better yet, find something intelligent to do with your mind.

  147. Lug says:

    Hey nutslikebush:
    It’s more fasinating to read what causes the suicidal Liberal mind:
    The Secret to the Suicidal Liberal Mind

  148. nutslikebush says:

    I think that conservatives are starting to realize that the Limbaughs, O’Reillys, Savages, Hannitys etc are like bartenders who keep telling them what they want to hear as long as the alcoholic keeps ordering more drinks (propoganda). The Murdochs and other extremists who control the mass media now have been polluting the information environment for years now and have turned radio talk shows and TV faux news into a virtual toxic waste dump. I see it as a hopeful sign that there is now a backlash against the conservative media propaganda and that conservatives are starting to recognize that they have been duped and used by the neocons. Now that the CIA has pursued justice against the Whitehouse and the Justice Department is getting to the bottom of some of the neocon vicious attacks against their critics, maybe some of the top neocons will go to jail for their roles in TreasonGate.

  149. Jack Antilla says:

    And So… The site Finaly dies.

  150. nutslikebush says:

    I would be interested in what you guys think about Wilkerson’s (Powell’s right-hand man at the State Dept) analysis of the Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Rice. In short he claims there was a cabal between Rumsfeld and Cheney, that Bush doesn’t know anything about foreign policy and doesn’t seem capable of learning, that Rice just sucks up to Bush to advance her career. Fascinating to read a recent insider’s perspective on the whole disaster of this administration.

  151. nutslikebush says:

    Remember, I am the one who in real life actually adopted children who others did not want. I would challenge you to put your money where your mouth is and take care of children but I think that living in a home with extremist right wing nuts is worse than death.

  152. nutslikebush says:

    In the future, please refer to me as nutslikebush.

  153. nutslikebush says:

    No righty,
    Life there is simply no particular moment in time when life begins. The boundaries are irreducibly fuzzy. You say life begins at conception – when is conception? When a sperm penetrates the ovum? When the first division occurs? When differentiation occurs? How about the question of when one becomes a human – it is infinitely more difficult and ultimately unanswerable. If you think it is answerable, you simply haven’t really thought about it.

  154. righty says:

    Ref. Your statement “The world is shades of grey. If you think anything important can be portrayed in black and white, then you live in a cartoon world like the fantasy world that Bush lives in.
    the blogger formerly known as Lefty.”

    Life IS in every aspect BLACK or WHITE. your ALIVE or DEAD. There is not in between.

    It is always clear when someone has no substance to talk about, that is when they call names (like cartoon character).

    The bottom line is you STILL cannot tell me when LIFE BEGINS. We must agree that MURDER is wrong. If you kill someone that is ALIVE, that is MURDER. So tell me logically when you believe someone is ALIVE.

    Righty (and Correcty)

  155. nutslikebush says:

    I know of one such case on a very personal basis. That, my friend, is enough to make the point in my world. I don’t want the government forcing yet another decision down my, or anyone else’s throat, who has already been violated horribly. It seems like letting conservative nuts like Righty have the power to make a deliberate rational decision instead of allowing the individual who actually has something at stake in the matter is absolutely insane. I wouldn’t trust people like Righty to be in charge of rearranging my sock drawer. I certainly don’t want such creeps having a say in any major decisions in my life. Keep your politics out of my personal life!

  156. nutslikebush says:

    I know of one such case on a very personal basis. That, my friend, is enough to make the point in my world. I don’t want the government forcing yet another decision down my, or anyone else’s throat, who has already been violated horribly. It seems like letting conservative nuts like Righty have the power to make a deliberate rational decision instead of allowing the individual who actually has something at stake in the matter is absolutely insane. I wouldn’t trust people like Righty to be in charge of rearranging my sock drawer. I certainly don’t want such creeps having a say in any major decisions in my life. Keep your politics out of my personal like!

  157. nutslikebush says:

    apparently you know how many abortions are associated with rape – do tell.

  158. nutslikebush says:

    You will note that I never said that our sexual urges can’t be controlled. That clearly was a misreading or intentional misinterpretation of what I said.

  159. nutslikebush says:

    I suppose the real point is that Kerry sucks and Bush sucks even worse. On the vietnam issue, all Kerry had to do to beat Bush was to report for duty (which Bush failed to do – remember). Kerry wasn’t a great candidate, but Bush is the worst president in history by any measure. PERIOD!

  160. nutslikebush says:

    some trivia – emperor penguins, eagles, and beavers are serial monogomists, not life-long monogomists. They ditch last season’s mates for new ones every year. So their “divorce rate” is even higher than humans’. Since we are asking extreme questions I suppose that I should ask you a question like this: if your daughter was violently raped by Charles Manson and she became pregnant, do you think the government should have the right to force her to bare his child? Or try this, if your daughter had a condition during pregnancy that meant that she would die if she continued to carry the fetus, should the government force her to give up her life to carry the fetus?

  161. nutslikebush says:

    did you pull the plug on your site?

  162. chitoryu12 says:

    Okay, who says that Kerry’s a war hero? The guy wanted to leave the war so badly that he gave himself “combat injuries” that a band-aid could fix. He shot an M79 grenade launcher at a riverbank near his boat. He also got some rice lodged in his ass once when he shot a sampan.

    Besides, didn’t he say that there were no war heroes in Vietnam? Oh, that’s right! He wasn’t talking about himself.

  163. nutslikebush says:

    Every year the US Dept of Health and Human Services publishes statistics on abortion. It turns out that women who are having abortions differ from your characterization. 19 percent are teenagers (so 81 percent of women who have abortions are 20-years-old or older. Low income urban teenagers, in fact, are the most likely to continue an unwanted pregnancy – just the opposite of what you said), 68 percent of those having abortions are white, 88 percent of abortions take place before the 13th week of gestation, only 1.5 percent of abortions happen after week 15. Interestingly, 43 percent of all adult american women have had at least one abortion. 70 percent of women who have abortions identify themselves as christians. So, most abortions are by white christian women who abort the fetus in the first 13 weeks of pregnancy. Those are the people you should be talking to if you want to change things. They are the ones sitting beside you in church. On the other hand, if none of the abortions that happened during the last 10 years had occurred, our economy would have now to generate an additional trillion dollars every year to cover the expense of taking care of them. the blogger formerly known as ‘Lefty’.

  164. nutslikebush says:

    The world is shades of grey. If you think anything important can be portrayed in black and white, then you live in a cartoon world like the fantasy world that Bush lives in.
    the blogger formerly known as Lefty.

  165. nutslikebush says:

    1.5 in my previous comment should have read 1.5 percent.

  166. Joy says:

    It seems that on the one hand you say that our sexual urge can’t be controlled, and on the other you talk about ‘date rape’.
    Honey, if the guys can’t control their sexual urges, how is there date rape? Aren’t they just acting on natural animal instincts and strong biological urges that they can’t control?
    Shouldn’t females just know that there will be sex if they spend time with (or if they come in the vicinity of) guys who are physically attracted to them? After all, that strong biological urge and their animal instincts may kick in at any time and they won’t be able to control them.

    The follow-through of the ‘logic’ of not being able to control our sexual urge means that there should be no punishment for ‘date rape’, as there would be no such thing.
    Maybe the Muslims who require the women to be covered from head to toe have the answer…except, doggone it all anyway, they still have ‘rape’ too.
    Alas, alas, where is the hope for us sexually driven animals who can’t control ourselves? We have evolved to a lower life form, it seems, than the emperor penguin and the eagle and the beaver and….

  167. Joy says:

    Actually, my question was how many abortions are performed due to rape and/or incest?
    Since rape was brought up by “Lefty” (or was it Anna? or Circe?), I wondered if she/he/they… knew the facts regarding the actual percentage of abortions performed due to rape.

  168. nutslikebush says:

    Every year the US dept of Health and Human Services published statistics on abortion. It turns out that women who are having abortions differ from your characterization. 19 percent are teenagers (low income teenagers are the most likely to continue an unwanted pregnancy, just the opposite of what you said), 68 percent of those having abortions are white, 88 percent of abortions take place before the 13th week of gestation, only 1.5 of abortions happen after week 15, 43 percent of all adult american women have had at least one abortion, 70 percent of women who have abortions identify themselves as christians. So, most abortions are by white christian women who abort the fetus in the first 13 weeks of pregnancy. Those are the people you should be talking to if you want to change things. On the other hand, if none of the abortions that happened during the last 10 years had occurred, our economy would have now to generate an additional trillion dollars every year to cover the expense of taking care of them. PS I used to be Lefty but now prefer to be call nutslikebush.

  169. righty says:

    You are doing what typical liberals do, avoiding the topic, spinning away from the question when you know your caught not knowing the answer. You need to go back and read my post, or not, since you have really have no intention of listening to reality.

    let me correct Lefty. Most abortions come from the lower class which in 95% of cases is inner city, urban teenagers. It you want to place a political affiliation on them (based on parents since teenagers do not vote) they would be DEMOCRATS!!! And its the REPUBLICAN TAXPAYERS who foot most of the bill through planned parenthood etc.

    Something every liberal should always remember:

    “Wrong is Wrong, even if everyone is doint it, Right is Right, even if no one is doing it”

    Abortion is FLAT Wrong.

  170. Lefty says:

    I don’t know the percentages. Why does that matter? I assume that most abortions are done by middleclass daughters of republicans (usually sorority girls, according to college statistics. Many of them were probably date raped by fraternity boys – also most of whom are republicans.). If you eleminated republicans you would cut abortion by more than half. I am sure of that.

  171. Lefty says:

    You profoundly misunderstand both the abortion issue and the basis of christianity. You are confused.

  172. krisitne89 says:


  173. Righty says:

    So, based on your statement “I do fervently believe, however, that a woman has sole responsibility at all times for all decisions regarding anything that is residing within her body” then you support the abortion of full term baby (40 weeks). The procedure IS completed by pulling out the babys head, killing it and then pulling the rest out.

    You seem more compasionate then that which is why i pointed out that if you going to say its right or wrong, then you have to determine why it would be wrong. It would be wrong when the baby is “human life”. It is FLAT WRONG in anyones book to kill human life. So when does human life begin. My point was that when you take out the clouds of MONEY and IRRESPONSIBILITY, the only conclusion is that it begins at conception.

    As far as you comments on religion, the last one was interesting. You said “(deep down they think of themselves as the god, or the ‘father, in the story).” That is somewhat humorous as the reality is that Christians (which is who your talking about, i am sure you tolerate any other religion) put all faith in GOD. Athiest, Humanists, etc… they put all their faith in Man. The rest of your comments are absolutely ridiculous attacks and typical of left wing zealots.

  174. Joy says:

    What percentage of abortions are performed due to rape/incest?

  175. Lefty says:

    Recall that the question was not, ‘when does life begin?’ The question was ‘when does one become human.’ Very different questions. You are right about the gills, they disappear a few weeks earlier and at 20 weeks embryos start looking a little less rat like. Ontogeny does appear to recapitulate phylogeny to some extend, doesn’t it. But babies are not born at 20 weeks – that’s not quite 50% through the gestation cycle.

    I should also know that I am a parent who has adopted children who I love and cherish with all of my heart – so I am probably quite different from your concept of who I am. Indeed you know virtually nothing about me (gender, age, race, nationality, education, how many different names I blog under on this site, etc….). I do fervently believe, however, that a woman has sole responsibility at all times for all decisions regarding anything that is residing within her body, be it human or parasite. I also believe that we must always protect women from those who would force them to bare the baby of a rapist etc. I also believe that we need to be protected from the religious zealots (power freaks) who would impose their fantasy world on rational people who have seen through the nonsense and chose to accept reality. The fact that my rejection of their fantasy religious beliefs infuriates them further suggests to me that the underlying motivation of their religion is to manipulate and control others (deep down they think of themselves as the god, or the ‘father, in the story).

  176. Righty says:

    without the sperm and the egg together, this is no life. When the egg and sperm mix, there is unique DNA that never changes. That my friend is conception and the beginning of life.

    On this topic, our problem as a society is that we are all about selfish convience. For the most part, abortion is a Birth Control for the irresponsible.

    btw, at 21 weeks gestation, a baby does NOT have gills. At 20 weeks gestation, babies are born and they don’t look rats.

  177. Jack Antilla says:

    Oh Joy, I’m one step ahead of you. I’ve been working on a China discussion for some time now,and it will be posted soon.

  178. Joy says:

    So, Jack,
    Start a China discussion under “commentary and articles” already. Another interesting topic!

  179. Joy says:

    Re: #83
    So, now someone’s opinion of our looks decides our humanity?
    I thought it had something to do with our DNA.
    I find the picture of the 21 week old male’s (his name was Samuel even then) tiny hand gripping the finger of the surgeon who performs spina bifida correction surgery on him very intriguing. Real photograph. Real surgery. ( Worth a thousand words, that one.
    Those little newborn (not even in utero, but born) kangaroos are interesting looking, aren’t they?
    And newborn rabbits…sheesh! Talk about your rodents!
    And seedlings, pollywogs, caterpillars…
    not very full-term looking. Must not be worth keeping.
    And newborn humans…(they are humans then,right? I mean, even though their skull isn’t completely closed and many look like little yodas, only hopefully not green and minus the ear-style)…
    don’t look like they will when they’re twenty. So what?
    Basing conclusions on looks alone and/or trying to use looks as evidence of proof of humanity or lack of it is poor science indeed.

  180. Lefty says:

    I can assure you that neither I nor anyone else can come up with a good answer to the question of when one becomes human (perhaps we never do). I am sure that if you thought about your answers you would find them unacceptable too. But at 21 weeks you still have gills and resemble a rodent more than a human, both anatomically and functionally.

  181. Righty says:

    What exactly defines a human? Shall I guess?

    How about Birth? if that is your answer, then is it ok to lethally pucture the skull of a 39 week unborn baby and pull it out as an abortion. (If you think that is acceptable, your SICK).

    How about “when its viable”? LOL, is that 20 weeks, 21 weeks, 21 weeks 1 day 2 hours,30 min and 3 sec? and if so, then if you abort it 1 sec or 1 hour earlier or later, what has changed?

    So Lefty, When does life begin? unfortunantly it is all about dollars and convience with the left.

    The only rational and consistent answer to when life begins is at Conception.

  182. Jack Antilla says:

    Joy, where I am, its a little bit different than regular military bases. I don’t know if you went to the Air academy or not, if you did you’d know that there is an exceptionally long commitment to it, one that the service has to pay for, and having another commitment gets in the way and they wind up wasting thousands of dollars on you, something that doesn’t make the ones paying for it very happy.

    Drugs and alcohol here are not easy to come by, and even if you do get them they’d be able to tell, after all unlike most colleges this one is extremely physical, and taking any kind of depressant will decrease your physical performance significantly.

    As for gossip, that’s a given in any environment, especially college.

    Which brings me to another point, High school I can guarantee you is a lot different now than when you went there. It’s good that you talk to your kids about the pressures they go through, but honestly you cannot contemplate what they go through without actually being there. After all, all teenagers keep secrets from their parents, no matter how open they are.

    I’m interested to here Anna’s take on this subject as if I recall right she’s in high school. I’m curious to see if it’s changed in the last 4-5 years.

    But I’m geting worn out over this whole abortion debate, every time it’s brought up the debate goes nowhere, just as it is now, I’d rather talk about more important things like what the hell we’re going to do about the economy, and more importantly, China.

  183. Lefty says:

    According to the Catholic church, masturbation (by males) ends a human life and is a sin. That of course is absurd. It is also absurd to consider a blastocyst a human being. A blastocyst is a human in the same sense as something that drips from your nose when you have a cold is a human.

  184. Joy says:

    Me again. Short comment.
    Remember, each ‘successful’ abortion ends at least one human life – how is that ‘safe’ for the woman having it
    (let alone the life that was ended)?
    I guess it depends on your definition of ‘safe’.

    It’s a fallacy to think that ending a human life is the better choice for those it seems to inconvenience.
    It never goes away…….

  185. Joy says:

    I have teenagers, male and female, and am aware of the extreme peer pressure – and general life pressure- to practice irresponsible sex.
    I was also a teenager myself, which gives me an advantage in helping my teens see danger zones ahead of time and steer clear of them. A lot of controlling the sex urge (NOT repressing it)has to do with not setting ourselves up in the first place. It also has to do with what we feed our mind. While we can’t stop thoughts, we can replace them.
    By the way, my husband and I didn’t die physically once we got married.
    A common misconception of marriage is that the sex drive is now easily controlled because there’s guaranteed sex with your spouse when it’s wanted/needed. Any other married people want to comment on THAT one?
    EVERYONE has to choose to be responsible with their sex drive. Being married doesn’t stop the desire to be attractive to the opposite sex, nor does it automatically enable us to turn off our physical senses, emotions and hormones. We have to practice the same basic control techniques throughout our lives.
    Granted, married people can have an advantage…which used to be one strong incentive for people (males particualarly) to get married.
    In summary; single and married people are sexual beings who can and need to practice control over their sex drive with realistic workable practices.
    Side note Jack: I was in the Air Force and am very aware of the pressure in the military. (a young pretty female in the service 25 years ago…can you begin to imagine the ‘pressure’?) On the surface its “Rah rah family” but in everyday life it’s a gauntlet of inuendos, double-meaning phrases, outright explicit tales and regales…you name it…and the barrage is constant and wearing, especially when living in co ed dorms on site. I don’t think it’s that much different than what college students and people who work outside the home face, basically. Easy availability of and constant exposure to drugs, sex (excuse me, can I come in my own room now?), alcohol, porn, cheating, ‘under the table’ side deals, politics, brown-nosing, gossip and lies about yourself, co-workers/dorm mates-Especially if you don’t participate in the illegal stuff…does that pretty much describe anything you’re familiar with? I forgot to mention that this is being practiced by the leadership, which makes it interesting for those lower in rank/station.
    I have a clue when I talk about the ability to control our sex drive. We’re all real people with real urges/drives/desires. We can’t make them go away, but we CAN control them.
    I say:
    Aim for the bullseye. When you miss, don’t assume it can’t be hit; learn from real people who hit it, readjust your technique and practice ’til you get it.

  186. Joy says:

    I was speaking of (and stated it as such)FAR left, not where the majority of real people on the ‘left’ are.

  187. bonniem says:

    Lefty, in your comment #74 to Joy, are you saying that the left doesn’t caricature the right, or conservatives, or Republicans. You are smart enough, surely, to know it goes both ways.

  188. Jack Antilla says:

    Couldn’t have said it better myself Bonnie, better the child die than be brought into the world unwanted, because when they’re aborted, atleast with abortion they can be spared the emotional and physical abuse that probably comes with unwanted childhood.

    you said it yourself Joy, the Family is the most important central unit in american society.

  189. Lefty says:

    I think that your understanding of liberalism is a caricature. The right has falsely portrayed liberal values for so long that the right now has absolutely no idea what it is that liberals actually believe on any issue. Your understanding of liberalism is a joke.

  190. bonniem says:

    Comment #1, That is the joke —– Liberals blame everything on Our President. You know he has even been causing the Hurricanes.(according to the Kennedys and other people who will grab anything out of the air to make our President look bad). If they don’t get their act together and start doing some positive things, other than whine and criticize — they will lose the next election also.

  191. bonniem says:

    Let me jump into this abortion discussion with just a thought. I know that in the 50’s and 60’s a lot of people did not have sex as teenagers, because it was still not widely acceptable. Some of the thoughts were, “What if I get pregnant?” or ” I don’t want to be known for sleeping around”. So it was a little easier to not be led into that temptation. If you don’t have sex the first time, then you don’t know what you are missing when the guy (for the most part) puts the move on you and tells you that if you really cared for him, you would “go all the way”. I know that a person ( a female ) can stay a virgin until married. But they have to be strong and self assured, and have a high moral value. But ——-for those who think they have to have sex in order to be liked, or loved, I am not sure abortion is a bad thing in some cases. Much better than having a child out of wedlock that will be considered a burden or mistreated, etc. So, with the morals our world has today, I don’t see changing Roe vs Wade anytime soon. Also, another trend I have seen in our local High School (even tho I know of 2 teens who are pregnant, unmarried, but will have the babies.) is oral sex. They feel this is the “safe way”. So where I think a person can and should save their virginty for marriage, I also realize it is not that easy for some. (Actually not easy for most – but some do anyhow. ) What I would like to see, is for the male and female take responsibilty for making sure they don’t get pregnant.

  192. Jack Antilla says:

    Joy, I never said to suppress the sex drive, I’m merely pointing out the flaw that you think the typical human being can control it, let alone the average American. It takes a serious amount of self discipline to control your sex drive, especially for males, I’m not saying suppress it completely, I’m talking about just keeping it under control, because sex, is EVERYWHERE, and America is one of the hardest countries on sex, go overseas to Europe or Japan, and it’s hardly censored. While by the way you talk it seems you have a decent control over it, many Americans do not because they are not disciplined enough to control it. Further more it’s a lot easier for married couples to control it because they’re committed, unless the marriage is weak, then one or both partners may feel the urge to have an affair, and they probably will because their self control is not enough to deny their urge.

    That’s why promoting abstinence alone will never work, especially for teens. Because nothing will prevent teen sex, especially nowa days, Just ask Anna, she’s probably a freshman or a sophomore in high school this year, I’m sure she can tell you all about the pressures of sex on teenagers.

    Right now I can’t give you many examples of college pressure, while I know it is extreme, I have not experienced it due to academy regulations and what not. Commitment to a family is not smiled upon here at all.

    If you really want to stop STD’s, Promote abstinence as it does get threw to some teens, but also teach usage of condoms and birth control, otherwise you’re in for a surprise.

    While I agree the Far left’s opinion of sex would lead to destruction, so would the far right.

    Think about it, They preach NO condoms, all abstinence, no birth control, etc.

    You think people are going to listen to that? NOOOO, we’d be reproducing at a rate that we’d consume this planets natural resources at such a rate we not only destroy our selves, but countless other species and ecosystems.

    There fore we must find a balance.

    And I doubt bestiality would EVER become normal, and Homosexuality, you have no right to deny those people sex, while it spreads disease, so does heterosexual sex. Child sex would never become the Norm, and along with bestiality, is not supported by the Left, and will never be accepted by our society. Teen sex already is the norm, just ask Anna about her high school, I doubt it is supported by the left, the left merely accepts there’s little they can do to prevent it, therefore try to push that Teens at least use protection.


    Jetz ist alles.

  193. jamie says:

    Go liberals-#69

  194. jamie says:

    i agree with u Jack

  195. moni says:

    go Conservatives

  196. Joy says:

    Two things, Jack and Lefty.
    1. I didn’t mention making abortion illegal…you did.
    2. I didn’t mention ignoring our sex drive – I spoke of controlling it.
    You both seem to think I’m talking about some weird kind of impossible total suppression. C’mon guys. I really think we’re at least partly on the same page as far as controlling our sex drive. This may be seriously naive of me, but I just don’t think that you two rush out and have sex with every person that you find sexually attractive.
    I’m talking about reality here, not some high-falutin’ ideas of pie-in-the-sky la-la land impossible purity. I’m talking about real life where more teens have or are carriers of STDs than don’t or aren’t. I’m talking about the present ‘pro choice’ leaders treating abortion as some sort of untouchable issue when, in fact, it involves true life and death-and needs to be truthfully addressed rather than covered with kitty litter in an effort to hide it. I’m talking about teaching our kids to respect themselves enough to wait until they can handle the possible results of sex (pregnancy) before they engage in it and SHOW THEM HOW and help them however we can.
    Another point: Lefty – you stated that our species would not survive without our sex drive. If we all follow the present far left liberal trend of accepting all types of sexual behavior, it seems that the American human species will need no enemies to wipe us out, as we will do it ourselves. Between abortion, homosexuality, multiple partners (thus spreading disease exponentially), child sex, teen sex, bestiality and who knows what else – if these lifestyles became the norm, how is that furthering our species? So, it is not our sex drive that keeps the human species going, but the proper use of it.

  197. Jack Antilla says:

    Joy, while the purpose of sex is procreation, It still doesn’t matter to our species, as you stated, we are different than other animals. And for one, besides dolphins, we are the only animals to have sex for fun, and nothing can or will change that, not religion, not law, nothing, and that’s why Lefty was right, Making abortion Illegal will not stop it, No more than prohibition stopped the consumption of Liquor, It will only serve to strengthen crime rates.

    It all comes back to what has been stated in my previous comment, things like this are hardwired into our subconscious, while it IS possible to suppress urges like you claim, it still requires a massive amount of self discipline, and if you look at the average American, self discipline on that scale is non existent, nor will it ever be existent.

  198. Lefty says:

    As you might have guessed, I don’t buy the basic assumption: i.e., that a creator put anything in anyone. i eschew magical thinking, sorcery, superstition and all other sorts of irrationality conceived by the tribes of yesteryear. Not that I am an atheist. I just believe that every form of religion offers a picture of a creator which greatly insults the creator (if there is one. After all, what respectable creator who want to be worshiped or would have the horrible personality that the one from the bible, Koran, or Tora has? Yuck! I wouldn’t tolerate a person with those characteristics, much less a diety.)

  199. Joy says:

    I think you misunderstood me or have some preconceived idea of my particular conservative view of the role of sex in life.
    I’ve been married for 22 years to the same man and we have 5 children who didn’t come through immaculate conception. I use fire, I feed hunger, I fill thirst and we have a very healthy and enjoyable outlet in each other for that strong biological urge – all the better for the committed relationship surrounding it. and…We care about how we look to each other.Get it?
    I’m not sure if my husband would punch your lights out for talking to me like that, or laugh at the absurdity of what you said. At any rate, I think I have a healthy view of sex and a realistic view of the consequences of irresponsible sex. I highly recommend healthy sex…within a committed-for-life monogamous relationship. I strongly urge abstaining from irresponsible sex outside of those, sometimes lifesaving, safety parameters.
    By the way, the strong biological urge has a bottom line purpose of what?…. I’m sorry, could you say it a little louder?…Oh, PROCREATION. Yes. And if you believed in a Creator, you might appreciate so much more that He made procreation enjoyable to our senses. It could’ve been otherwise you know. Anyway, even if you believe we’re animals, we could at least emulate those who mate for life and care for their young together. Don’t knock it until you’ve tried it.
    Those who emulate dogs and jackals tend to have personalities like them also.

  200. Lefty says:

    I recommend that you “give into the urge” sometime. It is really fun and I highly recommend it. Nothing better. And don’t knock it if you haven’t tried it.

  201. Jack Antilla says:

    Oh but Joy I have to disagree with you on that one.

    We ARE slaves to our bodies. Our minds while highly evolved, and according to some who believe in “higher evolution” our minds are trying, unsuccessfully to shed our bodies. But for right now we are still slaves to our instincts.

    Say I come running at you with a baseball bat, if you’re thinking about Aristotle or Confucius, I can guarantee you you’re going to stop thinking about Aristotle or Confucius and put your self-first. We have evolved a great sense of control over our body, especially the Buddhists and the Hindus threw extreme self-discipline, but we are still slaves to our bodies needs.

    At some point in your day, your body is going to stop thinking about whatever it is it’s thinking about, and tell you “hey, I got to eat” or “I got to take a crap”

    It all comes down to Mallow’s Hierarchy of needs.

    Hardwired into our subconscious or first priority is that of any Animal, our physiological need, Food, water, and reproducing the next generation of our species.

    Next is our safety and security, protecting us from harm

    Then we get more developed than many animals and work on love and affection.

    Then we go for our self-esteem

    And last, is our humanity, our self-actualization, our thinking about Aristotle or Confucius. But this comes last on our priority list.

    And as for torturing terrorists, that’s a different kind of urge not hardwired into our brains.

    That’s rage and hatred that is put there by traumatic evens such as seeing your best friend take a shot between the eyes, or watching as innocent people get shards of buildings stuck in their faces.

    We always have the potential for such de humanizing actions but we can suppress them because they are not required, they are not hardwired into our physiological needs.

    And as for your food reference, we suppress that threw obsession and brainwashing. Easy to do if you live in a society where it seems you’re expected to be super thin. It’s a disorder called Anorexia; it’s a psychological disorder, not a matter of discipline.

  202. Joy says:

    I agree that sex is natural and strongly biologically-driven…as is hunger, yet we find a way to control that biological urge when the motivation is sufficient i.e being attractive, being healthy, being comfortable, or whatever. We are not prisoners of our biology unless we voluntarily give up our responsibility to control our urges. Even then it is possible to become free and regain control.
    By the way, if we are animals through and through, and totally subject to our urges, why do you expect such high standards from Americans who are allegedly following their strong urges resulting in mistreatement of ‘terrorists’? Why should the ‘bad guys’ be treated any differently than they are treating others? I’ll tell you why: because we are above animals and capable of self-control and forgiveness and ‘unjustified’ mercy to our ‘enemies’.
    We are not animals through and through. We are mankind and need to have and uphold higher standards than the animal kingdom. Survival of the fittest doesn’t cut it for us. Standing up for the little guy does. Doing right no matter what the other guy does is what we should continually aim for-and hit more often than not. It is also possible to control our sexual urges. If it isn’t, then why do we have any standard regarding sex at all? Why is it called ‘cheating’ when spouses have sex outside of their marriage? Why do ‘affairs’ make all the rag sheets if they’re no big deal? Sex is a positive force when used correctly and a deadly force when used incorrectly – not unlike fire, which is also natural; yet rational people who would not think of irresponsibly playing with fire, risk their lives, and the lives of others, with irresponsible sex.
    If we want to be unaccountable, lets not blame it on our urges, let’s take the consequences that come bundled with our choices…without trying to fool ourselves for one minute that we just couldn’t help ourself. I’ve heard that excuse enough to last me a lifetime. Funny thing, in my case it was used by the perps. I can damn sure help those who can’t help themselves and free them of the source of their urge – so to speak. Except…I actually have and use the ability to control that strong natural urge and let justice come in due course. They have to answer for themselves and I have to answer for myself. Their weakness of character is no excuse for me to give in to my urges – no matter how strong or natural. What’s good for one strong urge is good for all. We can either control ourselves and all our biological urges, and use them responsibly, or we cannot.
    Life proves that we can when we choose to.

  203. Lefty says:

    But making abortion illegal will not reduce its frequency. It will just make it more dangerous. Just as many abortions will take place though – by conservative and liberal women alike. But women who can afford it will find relatively safer ways to have it done (i.e., travel to countries where it is legal) while the less economically fortunate will use risky procedures. Trying to talk people into not having sex is about as likely to work as asking fish not to swim. It is natural and strongly biologically driven. We are animals through and through after all and if our ancestors had not had irrationally strong sex drives, you and I would not be here. Nor would the human species survive.

  204. Joy says:

    Well, wading right into the hornet’s nest, so to speak, I’ll make some personal observations on abortion:
    -Many (most?) females seeking abortion feel overwhelemed and don’t clearly see any workable alternative.
    -The majority of abortions end in at least one human death (as the zygote/fetus is never other than human)-not counting the ‘failed’ abortions which end with a live birth.
    -Way too many abortions are repeat procedures and used as birth control.
    -While the zygote/fetus can be argued to be part of the woman’s body, it can also be argued to be part of the man’s body; as without his sperm, which was housed in his body, there would be no fertilization and no zygote/fetus.
    -Personally, I don’t see that advocating abortion has helped women in any way, shape or form.
    It has only made it possible for us to continue to use and be used by males, without considering consequences of irresponsible actions. I see it as a high price to pay for ‘freedom’ to live our lives as we choose. Freedom is being free to do better, not to do ourselves and others harm.
    Anna, you’ve mentioned that our fates are intertwined, and they are. What we do – even in private – affects others because it affects our character one way or another, which affects our choices and actions, which affect our life direction, which affects many.
    Personally, I think our present society is too focused on individuals getting theirs as opposed to working as a unit toward the common good. I see no common good for us, our nation or our world in having irresponsible sex with other people behaving irresponsibly as if we are the end in and of ourselves. I like the ‘liberal’ ideology of helping those less fortunate, but I see a blind spot in helping the most helpless who wasn’t even given a choice to be brought into being. Ridding our bodies (but never our lives)of an unplanned pregnancy has never proven to be a positive force.
    In closing, it seems that preventing pregnancy in the first place by encouraging and practicing self-control (the only true control possible) in our sexuality should be our focus. Hey, why waste all that energy on irresponsible sex when there are soooo many problems in society that need addressing through action?
    Maybe we could get out of bed and get on with life.

  205. Anna says:

    Read what you wrote again. Then think about it. I believe that if you think about what you wrote, it will start to seem very strange to you.

  206. Brad says:

    Wow. Anna’s comment was extremely f’d up. Apparently she doesn’t know the difference between a “fake conservative” and a true conservative. The fake conservatives includes people like Bush, Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity. These guys somehow get hicks/rednecks/trailer-park trash to support them, but in reality, they’re a bunch of liberals disguised as conservatives. And the south and west have a bunch of these fakes getting abortions. And obviously, they also oppose conservation, when in reality, should be supporting it. It is in their name: conservative, conservationist,conservative, YOU GET THE POINT. A true conservative, or paleo-conservative, is someone who is a true chrisitian (no divisions; that means there is no such thing as “Baptist” “Escapalean” “Anglican” etc. that make chrisitanity seem unofficial) and a conservationist, and also despise racism of any kind. The only famous person I know of who is a paleo-conservative is Michael Savage, and he can prove any liberal wrong on any subject. He also despises Limbaugh and Hannity. Listen to his radio show some time. You’ll become 10x smarter.

  207. Jack Antilla says:

    I say this is why religion should be left out of government affairs, it causes problems. Right now there are 3 groups battling it out for power, the Sheittes, The Sunni, and the Kurds. All of which hate each other because of religion, after all it’s not like they worship the same god or anything.


    This is why the British should have paid more attention to the peoples of the middle east before dividing up territories into countries, because they grouped people together that hate each other, and it’s this disunity that lead to the rise of people like Saddam Hussein in the first place.

    If the Iraqis left religion out of the government as, it utterly pains me to say this, Saddam did, they would be just fine, and that’s one of the reasons Saddam was able to keep the county in order. Though it would have been much better had he not advocated Rape, torture and murder as a means of controlling political rivals. If this government were able to put in a “freedom of religion” defined in their bill pf rights, as well as a “separation of religion and government” It would be just fine.

    But really I don’t like focusing on this now while the insurgency is still recruiting foreign fighters from other countries, and gaining access to massive stockpiles of weapons. There simply aren’t enough troops to maintain security AND train Iraqi National Guard units, AND re-build the county all at once.

    I think we need to take care of the Insurgency THEN focus on the government. After all, what a disaster it would have been had our founding fathers focused on drafting the articles of confederation while the British still had strongholds in the North East.

  208. Jack Antilla says:

    Kristine, since when did this turn into a childish playground brawl. “I have WAY more ppl who got my back…so don’t even start with me…..”

    Seriously I thought I was having an adult conversation but I guess not.

    Any way, it looks like my previous reply to your comment didn’t make it through so I’ll have to re-state it.

    I don’t advocate abortion. Murder is defined as taking away the heartbeat and brainwaves. The child gains these at 2 weeks into the pregnancy not at conception, but yes pretty damn close. However, it’s still the woman’s body. And therefore her right to choose what to do with it. And besides would you rather an unwanted child be brought into the world? This is cause for abuse, sometimes on an emotional scale, and sometimes on a physical scale, and rarely, you get things like “A child called it”

    And I must stress your “those Arabs had it coming” is based on the assumption that it was the Iraqi insurgency responsible for 9/11, which it wasn’t, it was Al-Quida, 2 very, very separate groups.

  209. Joy says:

    Regarding Iraq-
    Ah, how to organize those people:
    That is interesting main point right now, isn’t it? The Iraqi ‘leaders’ in Iraq won’t agree on how they want their government run. The bottom line issue seems to be…
    “Do we rule under this Islamic faction or that Islamic faction?”
    One wild-eyed faction figuratively runs around tearing their hair, rending their garments and crying disunity and lack of representation when other factions won’t demand strict and rigid ‘Islamic’ control in the constitution. No matter how political they try to make it sound, the bottom line bone of contention there right now among the leaders is religious control.
    That, of course, is my interpretation of their words and activity.
    What say you?
    Also Paul, Lefty, Circe, Suzanne,bonniem,…?

  210. Anna says:

    Research shows that just as many conservatives and children of conservatives have abortions as liberals. What does that imply? There is no difference between the two groups on this issue when the matter becomes one of personal choice.

  211. Jack Antilla says:

    Joy, The reason the issues are blurred is because both parties don’t seem content until they’ve destroyed the opposite philosophy. Both sides put spin on the issues to make the other party look bad, and I must say it’s rather annoying. I’ve heard very little talk on solving issues in general such as the war in Iraq, all I’ve heard is rhetoric about either how everything is catastrophically wrong over there, or how everything is fine and dandy and there’s no problems at all that we’re winning the war. The reality is a mixture of both but neither side wants to admit that.

    Iraq is being re-built, schools are being set up, and water and power are being restored even though in some areas electricity only exists for a few hours at a time. We are winning most major engagements with the insurgency but that doesn’t bring us any closer to wining the war, as we’re fighting an enemy that is not afraid to die and take as many with us as possible. All the while the majority of Iraqies look forward to living under a government of the people, if only they could agree on how to organize those people.

    That is what is really happening in Iraq, but we will never hear it from either party. It’s either we’re winning and the insurgency is in it’s “last throws” or we’re dying in the hundreds and every one there hates us.


    Thank god I’m in the military and can get my Iraq news from my buddies on the front lines instead of mainstream politics.

  212. Joy says:

    I think you might find some verrry interesting facts if you do some research regarding how far into pregnancy that abortion is legal…as well as how many are done in the second and third trimesters. While what you stated regarding some doctors not performing abortions past a certain point is true, there are way too many more who prefer the big money of abortion to the best interest of the ‘patient'(woman) and perform them on what is undeniably -to any rational being-a human child.
    I think you have the right idea of not finger-pointing, but actually solving the problem. That’s the tricky part. There seem to be 2 vastly different schools of thought as to what the problem is. How can there be unity on a solution when there is no unity on what the problem is?

  213. krisitne89 says:

    dude…as soon ans a baby is consived…it has a heartbeat…so therfore….YOU KILL INNOCENT CHILDREN!!!!!and Jack…if you haven’t realized yet…this blog is for LAUGHING AT LIBERALS…so i highly doubt that you can defeat me…I have WAY more ppl who got my back…so don’t even start with me…..

  214. cherry says:

    hey whoever said the one about Bush and whats worse than an incompitent liberal . You are mentally ill seriously . Liberal people are so dumb. I hate everyone of them with a passion . Most couldnt find there ass with both hands!

  215. Jack Antilla says:

    Gee Kristine, where is an unborn child? THE MOTHERS BODY! THATS WHAT IT HAS TO DO WITH! The Unborn Child can only be aborted in the Early stages of pregnancy before the brain develops or any true consciousness is achieved, while there is a heart beat and therefore the child is alive, it cannot be determined whether or not the child is aware or even conscious, Most Doctors refuse to do It after a cretin point, therefore the Individual in development is still a part of the Mothers Body. And guess what? Conservatives are just as bad as liberals when it comes to bashing each other and not shutting up, Which Neither side should shut up, they just need to re-direct their focus from absolute hostility to each other like you preach, and focus on coming up with SOLUTIONS TO PROBLEMS, NOT PEOPLE TO BLAME FOR THEM. And I agree aspects of Liberalism are wrong, but then again, the same can be said for conservatives. That’s why I try to find Balance as best I can.

  216. krisitne89 says:

    unborn children are a totallly different person…how is it the mother’s body??? but the thing about liberals is that they always go in a circle and they never shut up…..liberals need to realize that they are wrong…..SO DEAL WITH IT!!

  217. Jack Antilla says:

    Kristine, You have the wrong Idea completely. Democrats don’t kill babies, Irresponsible mothers and certain circumstances kill babies, Democrats simply support the right of the mother to choose what to do with her body.

    And about the war, the reverse can be said for Republicans, You Cry about abortion and killing unborn children, but don’t give a damn in the world about the children affected by the War in Iraq.

    In my mind they’re both hypocrites.

    And as for intelligent Liberals, Many of the people I’ve studied under in the Past were liberal, while I disagree with some of the things they say, I respect them greatly, just as I respect the many conservatives that I also disagree with.

    And anonymous, I agree I’m not getting anywhere here, but I do find the debate stimulating. I am currently at WestPoint military Academy and when I graduate, hopefully I’ll be able to make more of a difference, but for now, correcting the errors of those on the blogosphere will have to do.

  218. - says:

    Good for you. I can’t respect “intellects” who can’t spell.

    PS- Jack, I feel sorry for you. You have the right idea, but you’ll never soar like an eagle when your flying with a bunch of turkeys. Frankly, the writing on this page is barely legible. These people are near illiterate. Good luck to you.

  219. krisitne89 says:

    oh….might i add….i find that you telling me to respect ppl is rediculus….I can’t respet someone who kills unborn children…..that’s sick and barbaric….you guys also whine about the war and how many soldies have died….well…thaose arabs came over here and killed hundreds of thousands of innocent ppl…so we are simpluy getting back at them…so don”t tell me who I should respect….cuz i can’t respect the disrespectful…


  220. krisitne89 says:

    Sorry Jack, but I’ve never met a smart liberal in my whole life…they are idiotic crybabies…..Here they are complaining about the thousands of soldiers that have died from the war….but because of the Democrats making abortion leagal in some states……there are more than a million babies dying each year…so who are the killers here???…..when can you can tell me that????….


  221. Jack Antilla says:

    Kristine, I know many highly intelligent intellectual liberals, so don’t disrespect these great minds by telling them they have the IQ of a vegetable. It’s fair to say the both sides have highly intelligent people as well as complete morons as I’ve discovered in my recent surfing of both liberal and conservative blogs.

    I also say it would be best if both sides engaged in civilized discussion and debate to help solve problems rather than dismissing each others views completely and bashing everything they say.

  222. Kristine says:

    This is to all the liberals out there….

    Thanks for your contribution, but if I had wanted to hear from somebody with your IQ, I’d be at my local supermarket talking to the vegetables. Is that a conclusion or simply the place where you got tired of thinking? A long period of non-posting would be most welcome on your part. I suggest you need Mark Twain’s advice; “It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.”

  223. Mr. Jack says:

    Ummm, John Kerry lost because the man has no clue how to run a campaign, he doesn’t know how to manipulate the media as effectively as Bush, He picked a poor choice for a running mate, (Still think he should have choose a republican)
    And most of all, it was hard to stay awake during his speeches; it had nothing to do with his philosophy. To tell you the truth, Im not sure what the outcome would have been if this were a battle of philosophy, its hard to tell with all the spin both side put on every issue, and all the political bashing going on. Just go to Blogs for Bush, I think theres a link to it on this site, those people have no interest in their parties philosophy, they only care about bashing democrats. I believe that to truly move this nation forward, people like Right-Man, and NY GIANTS FAN need to stop bashing the other party and work WITH them to come up with a solution to the problems that face our country that both sides agree upon. But, as Joy would put it “Im living in a dream world”

  224. Zach says:

    And what does that have to do with the current conversation #37?

  225. NY GIANTS FAN says:

    fuck you liberal — john kerry lost for a reason man has no plan — why 80% of americans backed Bush

  226. NY GIANTS FAN says:

    LIBERALS ALWAYS SAY BUSH A MORON – CANT BE A MORON AND BE A PILOT just another reason why i laugh at dem libs– stupid idiots- liberals just mad they couldnt get any dirt on Bush

  227. Mr. Jack says:

    Josh, where did you ever get the Idea that I hated this country? When I stated above that other countries are in better shape, doesn’t mean I hate this one; I merely think our leaders could do a better job maintaining it. And tell me, if I hate this country so much why did I join the Army? Why did I serve in Afghanistan? And why, once Im out of WestPoint, will I immediately go over to Iraq? I don’t know about you, but I don’t think some one who hates America would then go to fight for it. I love this country, I do not love its leaders, and there is a difference between the two.

    My country right or wrong; if right, to be kept right, and if wrong, to be set right Major General Carl Schurz, 29 February 1872

  228. Josh says:

    First, ell said Kay. Second, Mr. Jack, I don’t know if you’ll be reading this but if you dislike this country so much, why not just leave? I’m sure most of us who actually love America would be better off. “If you don’t want to root for the team get out of the stadium!”

  229. Kay says:

    I liked the jokes at the very top of the site. I’m not saying that I don’t like Democrats (I don’t like Democrats), I’m just saying that I don’t want a bunch of softies “talking” to the terrorists. That is a red-flag to terrorists to attack us once more. I like the idea that my President can tell them to f**k off. Hell, if I could, I’d be shoving flags up their cracks instead of putting panties on their heads. I don’t think liberals realize that terrorists don’t care if you’re ‘nice’ to them. They blow THEMSELVES up to kill anyone who disagrees with them. In short- You either sympathize with terrorists, or you don’t. If you do, get out of my country, and if you don’t, God bless you. Bush is my President and I’m proud of him, no matter how nit-picky you liberal morons get. He has the guts and the power to fight terrorism. I do, too. Do you?

  230. Suzanne says:

    Just a vague question
    Republicians, Democrats, Liberals, Conservatives, Moderates, Radicals, and several other catagories of political groups of people some place each individual.
    Does anyone know the exact qualifications of each individual catagory?
    Is it possible not to be in any catagory.
    Is it possible just to believe what one believes and not only believe within the bounds of a specific group?
    Is it possible in anyones mind that a person may be a bit of that and a touch of the other and some of even a different one and then also believe in something that none of these groups believe in?
    Is there such a thing as a non catagory person?
    Just wondering.
    I thought we had gone beyond this catagory thing when we stoped being racist.
    Or are we still racist but in the Political race.
    Oh, do these people in different catagories, do they have specific character traits? Or either male or female, within specific age groups?
    Just thinking on a very chilly rainy Saturday evening in the Strong Republician State of Utah.

  231. Suzanne says:

    Gee Nikky
    Jesus was a Liberal
    Think you might rethink your comment!

  232. Mr. Jack says:

    First off Nicky, what country are you from? I can guarantee you it’s in better shape than the U.S is. For example, you probably have free health care, while our rates are skyrocketing. You probably have a cleaner environment, while we have oil hungry pigs (Oil industry, not Bush, for all you hotheaded conservatives out there.)
    Mr. Jack

  233. Nikky says:

    Hello,I would just like to say that all liberals cant do shit! Like look at are prime mionister he steals money from us! Then everybody just sits around and lets him get what ever he wants….So that shows the liberals for ya!!!!!The person who is running our contrey shouldnt get second chances!!!!VOTE FOR CONSERVATIVE, you might accomplish seomthing

  234. Bush is my god says:

    Q: What’s the difference between a Democrat and a trampoline?
    A: You take off your shoes before you jump on a trampoline.

  235. bushluver09 says:

    I agree with #26 and i luv listening to the debates on this site!! Democrats comments are the funniest cause they are so stupid and immature and make no sense!!

  236. RJ Winans says:

    I strongly agree but # 25 isn’t really doing anythig to this website except dissing it! Its really good!

  237. anarchy please says:

    I enjoy most of the things that were posted for a laugh, but to those of you that are offended I would suggest lightening up a bit. Some people really aren’t educated in politics, but just because someone doesn’t agree with you does not mean that they are automatically ignorant.

  238. conservitive comic says:

    bush fell of his bike too!

  239. conservitive comic says:

    bush fell of his bike too!

  240. Sean says:

    Serb National,
    I’m Impressed with your reply to Jon Ferguson.

  241. Sean says:

    Jon Ferguson,
    Exactly what Moderate War hero would you be referring to. It can’t be Bill Clinton because he was a draft dodger, and it can’t be John Kerry because he wasn’t a War Hero…or a moderate. So I guess you’re referring to Al Gore.

  242. RD Davis says:

    How many demokkkrats to change a bulb ? 2……..1 to change the bulb, and 1 to kiss my *ss.

  243. chillliberal says:

    S. N. Thanks again for the daily humour…do you write on this board on weekends too…wow!

    Questionning a soldier’s reputation is very touchy…especially if you never did any real military service. Just seeing the horrific images would be enough to cripple most of us for life! Forget about sleeping for while…it’s bad enough that Kerry had to go to Vietnam for that ”not very smart war” (see Documentary Fog of War)…this shouldn’t be a public subject at all…especially with his oponents record.

  244. Serbian National says:

    How many people here would write up false documents in order to get that Purple Heart, stating that, instead of falling off your bike, you ran into heavy enemy fire and took three bullets to the chest, but killed at least twenty enemy soldiers on your own?

  245. Hwo says:

    wait a minute wait a minute
    WAR HERO? ‘fergy’ u got a big surprise ahead
    he went AGAINST REGULATIONS, SHOT AN UNARMED SOLDIER, AND CLAIMED A PURPLE HEART FOR A SCRATCH! How many people here would accept a purple heart for falling off a bike?

  246. john says:

    Nobody laughed at that “how to mak a liberal angry” joke a few posts ago. That was the best!
    I’ll google bush flip-flop after this post. Should be interesting. I don’t recall ANY. Kerry played all sides (the bagged goose was a good touch).
    He started seeing the light and stated definitively that he was going to go over there and kill Bin Ladin. I could picture him straping on the ol’ pearl handles.
    Oh yeah, he was pretty firm about how Cheney’s daughter (who is a lesbian) could tell us that homosexuality is something you are born to.
    Not one liners but just remembering that last debate that Kerry “won” is kind of funny.

  247. thank god 4 bush says:

    ok, I just HAVE to comment on the, “drunk fascist” statement – #1 – drunk? where the hell did you get that bull shit from? probably dan rather. And #2…fascist? If you weren’t so ignorant you would know that taking fascism to the extreem is allowing ultimate government control, something conservatives know leads to disaster – liberals haven’t picked up on that yet. And for gods sake! get off the fact that Kerry was in Vietnam, and NO he wasn’t a hero…he has desperatly tried to make himself seem that way, but he’s far from it.
    But then again, there is no need to fight because the majority of the United States is intelligent and THANK GOD George Bush is back in office.

  248. Serb National says:

    Fergy, your head is so far up your ass we’d need an oil drill to get it out. Bush might have a few flip flops, I defy you to find a President or politician who doesn’t, but he’s far, far, FAR removed from Kerry’s “The People Are Always Right” policy. Unfortunately, the people aren’t always right and always blindly following the most popular idea isn’t a great idea if you want to be elected to any office.

    We’ve been over this before, and I’m sure we’ll go over it again because of the first idea mentioned in this little post, but you have no idea what fascism is. Read a few books on Nazi Germany, or on the USSR. Hell, pick up 1984 and read it (its by George Orwell, same guy who wrote Animal Farm) and you will see fascism. We are not living in anything like a fascism.

    As to Kerry being moderate: you freaking wish.

    That is all I shall say on that subject.

  249. Chris says:

    Hey, you guys want to make liberals angry?
    Defend the United States.

  250. Jonathan Ferguson says:

    Bush has more flip-flops than John Kerry. If you weren’t ignorant, you’d know that already. Just google bush flip flops and you’ll find dozens of examples. It’s funny you support a drunk fascist and ridicule Democrats for supporting a moderate war hero.

  251. Gavin says:

    this is funny

  252. stephanie says:

    oh and by the way,Dani, if you had morals and were educated , you would be a conservative independent like me!

  253. stephanie says:

    that wasn’t even a good joke,Dani, because you obviously don’t know what you’re talking about. most republicans are NOT rich, notice that most of the billionaires in this country are democrats (and the democrats are the ones protecting pricks like you!)

  254. Dani says:

    This is a good joke.
    The Republicans today announced that they are changing their emblem from an elephant to a CONDOM because it more accurately reflects their political stance:
    A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you’re actually being screwed.

  255. Anonymous says:

    I don’t like everyone making fun of John Kerry flip-floping on issues. It’s not nice to make fun of legally schizophrenic people. :)

  256. Steve says:

    That’s fair :)

  257. zoot potatoe says:

    I know, the entire point of my mocking “dont go crying yet” and “zing” was meant to emphasize that I have no clue what I am doing or talking about when it comes to the jokes, andI actually had meant to put a 😛 next to it, but I forgot when my post got erased and so I had to create a fresh batch of boring “slapped together” new jokes.

    also, I posted my stupid jokes because it emphasized the blind stereotypes that one will experience when they find (and become devoted to) their candadate. I’m that type of person that am hard to interprut because the posts have no feelings in it, so while I saw myself as joking, it is evident others will see it as a serious attempt to disregard the liberal jokes…

  258. Steve says:

    The second joke was actually funny, even though I disagree with the message. Incidentally, all the “anti-liberal” jokes mentioned above were also funny. Just because a joke bashes the opposite party doesn’t make it funny, zoot. It takes some creativity and relevance to issues. You stumbled on that in number too, but otherwise, total failure. The other 3 are just flat out insults, and therefore not funny.

  259. zoot potatoe says:


    Q: how many conservatives does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
    A: Who knows? they are so stuck in the past they still use candles


    Q: how many conservatives does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
    A: 2. one to screw it in and one to make rediculous claims that man-lightbulb relationships destroy america


    Question: whats the difference between a conservative and someone in a mental institution?
    Answer: Not much, actually

    Question – What is the only thing worse than an incompetent liberal President?
    Anser- George W. BUsh

    I am sure that these slapped together jokes will make you laugh your stitches off as much as the jokes above tickled your funny bone…

  260. Shadow says:

    The last joke was quoting a liberal.

  261. Heather says:

    I agree!

  262. Republican= American says:

    I strongly disagree with the last joke about it being bush’s fault for it being dark. Instead of blaming our president we should be blaming the Anti-American forces that really caused the problems.

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