Stephanie vs. Draco
If you’ve been around LaughAtLiberals.com, you’ve noticed our regular visitors debating liberal vs. conservative ideas. Some of these discussions have been quite interesting and heated. We really appreciate that because we love discussing ideas. Hey, that’s what the site is for, right? So, this thread is especially for stephanie and Draco to convince us. Enjoy…
Posted by admin on October 26th, 2004 in Articles | 45 Comments »
Serbian National Says: October 26th, 2004 at 2:43 pm
Sorry to intrude upon this thread, but I am eager to be informed by Stephers as to a few points of contention of mine.
First, Stephers, what does Kerry actually plan to do differently in Iraq to make it better?
Secondly, how does Kerry plan to clear Russia of all nuclear weapons or weapon-grade plutonium in 4 years?
And finally, how will unilateral, as opposed to the current multilateral talks with North Korea, help us in getting N Korea to disarm? As a side note on this question, how can Kerry say that you need unilateral talks in N Korea but say that going into Iraq alone is wrong?
JD Says: October 26th, 2004 at 3:48 pm
I am confused. Are Draco and Serbian National the same guys?
JD Says: October 26th, 2004 at 4:59 pm
Hey why do liberals get their own thread? I want my own, too.
Serbian National Says: October 26th, 2004 at 5:06 pm
Draco is many times my better, I just wanted a place to ask Stephers some questions that I try and ask everyone, but have never had answered.
Emory Says: October 26th, 2004 at 8:41 pm
It’s okay to give liberals their own thread to demonstrate compassionate conservatism
stephanie Says: October 26th, 2004 at 11:06 pm
First of all,I do not know how Draco got to calling me “Stephers” but I will not answer any questions by anyone who calls me this. I also hope that Serbian National was not implying that I was a liberal with his/her questions. Why would Serbian National ask me all these questions about John Kerry?
Serbian National Says: October 28th, 2004 at 1:47 pm
I’m just curious, and as I said, I as everyone.
Michael G Says: October 31st, 2004 at 2:40 pm
I happen to think a liberal is actually someone that doesn’t have “Values”. They stand up for rights that were never granted. The reason they were never granted is because as a “Whole Civilization” we must have laws that ALL people can live by without offending others! Kerry represents nothing but his own salvation of a long political life. I don’t believe our forefathers ever thought this country was to be a permanent workplace for a select few (congressmen & Senators). They figured there would be enough people in this country to take their turn at expressing and contributing their ideas in the running of this great nation!! That is the problem! Our United States has become Stagnant! We are not turning over our representatives quickly enough to keep coming up with fresh ideas for this Great Nation! The representatives we elect today are more concerned with keeping their jobs and all the perks that go with it, then they are at actually being productive!! This is Why we need term limits!! Kerry says whatever the people he is talking to want to hear. When he represented our country as a U.S. Senator….where were all these great ideas he has always had? Why has he never put them forth before now to better our nation? Why would he let 1000 men die in Iraq (since he can solve this)before the presidential election? Did he let them die for him so he could talk about what he will do (never specifically, I might add)so he could get elected? And just where is HE going to get 40,000 more troops if they are not available to Bush? It’s time to stand up and let our voices be heard…to follow through….to fight for term limits (2 terms and OUT forever)…to straighten out the mess that professional politicians have put us in!!
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 6:30 pm
Michael, the first part of your statement is incoherent and divisive. I’ll give you a few Democratic values that John Kerry and I share:
America should be respected and admired around the world so that we can lead strong alliances.
America should only go to war as a last resort. We should only go to war unilaterally when we must, and forge strong alliances when we can, not the other way around.
America should educate its children.
America should care for its seniors.
America should show fiscal discipline.
America is strongest when we have a strong middle class with a rising standard of living.
America should, like every other first world nation on the planet, provide health care for its citizens.
Americans should have the right to dissent without being branded as traitors. “Dissent is the highest form of patriotism.” – Thomas Jefferson
Politicians shouldn’t hide behind our troops when trying to justify fatally flawed policy decisions and blunders. Our troops deserve better than that.
America should not discriminate against someone based on their sex, color, sexual orientation, national origin, etc.
Those are just a few Democratic values.
Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:26 pm
Ferguson: Democratic values? I take it from your list you are for school vouchers, against affirmative action, for the prescription drug benefit, hate political correctness, and are for slashing social spending but not the military. You recognize the 30 or so countries that are with us in Iraq. And you agree with a bilatteral approach to North Korea. And you see the liberal bias in the media. You are a conservative after all!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:29 pm
So I can take it from your list you are against affirmative action, for school vouchers, for the prescription drug benefit and slashing social spending but not the military. And you recognize their is a liberal bias in the media. You are a conservative after all!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:30 pm
Ferguson, from your list can I then conclude you are against affirmative action?
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:31 pm
Hell I think you are for school vouchers, against affirmative action and recognize the liberal media bias. You are a conservative after all!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:32 pm
And I am still waiting on that specific thing that Bush has done that makes him a fascist.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:38 pm
I’m against quotas. I think it’s unfair that black students in poor neighborhoods get a crappier education than white students in wealthy neighborhoods. But yes, in principle I’m opposed to affirmative action.
I’m for quality education for America’s youth that doesn’t require them to enroll in faith-based schools. How we get there is of secondary concern to me.
A strong case can be made that 20 years ago there was a ‘liberal’ media bias. That case just can’t be made and a strong case can be made that the opposite is true, there is a strong ‘Republican’ bias in the media, particularly since 9/11. There are certainly exceptions, like the New York Times, but most media outlets are captives of their corporate parents’ agendas, which go hand-in-glove with the fascist Republican agenda.
Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:40 pm
Can’t you see you are co-opting the conservative agenda? Just what is it in your delusional mind that makes us fascists?
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:41 pm
I already responded to your ‘specific thing’ challenge in the thread where you made the challenge. Let me know if you have trouble comprehending my response and I’ll try to reword it with smaller words.
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:42 pm
So you like the Skins. I bet you think Marion Berry is a great guy too, huh?
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:43 pm
John Kerry and I are centrists. You and your ilk, in one of your few lucid moments, perceive that we are ‘co-opting the conservative agenda’ because you have drifted so far to the right. That’s a good example illustrating how fascist you have become, thanks. Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:43 pm
You are going to have to because I ain’t gettin it.
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:45 pm
Ok, now we are getting somewhere! The old “centrist” label, as if that is the best place to be. Can’t you see that ever liberal like Kerry has to run as a conservative to get elected? They don’t run as liberals that is for sure.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:46 pm
No, I want the Skins to lose today because of the correlation between the fate of the Skins and the fate of the incumbent on election day.
Marion Barry (you thinking Halle Berry?) is unfit for the same reason that George Bush is unfit. He abused cocaine throughout his 20′s and 30′s and doesn’t have the moral authority to lead.
JD Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:46 pm
I have to rake my leaves but I will be back in in an hour and will wait for your answer.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:49 pm
Bill Clinton ran as a centrist, governed as a centrist, and was the greatest president in US history.
Yes, centrist is the best place to be.
Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!
Jonathan Ferguson Says: October 31st, 2004 at 8:53 pm
John Kerry, even if he wanted to, which he doesn’t, knows he can’t attempt to govern as a liberal, so that’s a moot point.
In the Senate he didn’t push a liberal legislative agenda, he’s known best for 2 things: going after the Iran-Contra-cocaine scandal, finding out and revealing the facts, and dealing with the Vietnam POW issue. He was right on both of those issues.
He too has run as a centrist, will govern as a centrist, and will be a fine president.
JD Says: November 1st, 2004 at 1:15 am
Ferguson, I don’t disagree about Clinton. But I have news for you. Kerry is no Clinton. He is a liberals liberal, and that is according to their own rankings.
JD Says: November 1st, 2004 at 1:20 am
Listen, the biggest problem right now is Iraq. Kerry won’t have the political courage to stay the course in Iraq. He will be under big pressure from the anti-war crowd that got him elected and he will cut and run before “Bush’s War” becomes “Kerry’s War”. And that would be a huge mistake. Don’t give me that “allies are coming” crap. It won’t happen.
JD Says: November 1st, 2004 at 1:22 am
Kerry won’t hurt the economy. Bush has that all set up for him. It is in Iraq that that weenie will screw our country.
stephanie Says: November 1st, 2004 at 3:11 am
I think it’s funny that liberals are on this site. I’m glad you all find it a priority to come here and argue with us!Thanks again!
Anonymous Says: November 1st, 2004 at 4:33 am
You said Bill Clinto was the greatest president in US history? Wow you have some messed up views kid.
-John Kerry is the grinch… let’s save Christmas together!!
Anonymous Says: November 1st, 2004 at 4:34 am
Olympics
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:19 am
JD, again, whether you think Kerry will govern as a liberal or not, he’s campaigning as a moderate and with a Republican congress he will govern as one. My guy supports the pay-as-you-go rules that got the budget balanced. Your guy doesn’t. ‘Nuff said on who’s the ‘true’ conservative.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:23 am
On Iraq: It’s a huge stinking mess. No question about that. It’s your guy’s mess and it’s not fair that our guy will have to clean it up. But John Kerry is used to life not being fair and getting on with business. George Bush said that if the Iraqi people vote for an Islamic government, that’s up to them. John Kerry will not leave Iraq in anarchy. He may well leave it in the hands of an Islamic government, as would Bush. That sucks. Unfortunately, that’s the option your guy left us with. Islamic countries tend to have islamic governments.
Iraq was a happy exception to that rule until someone decided that having a stable secular (yes, brutal and repressive as well, like every other country in the region) government there was a bad idea. No doubt you freepers will delight in beating up President Kerry over that, we’ll see who the American people believe.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:27 am
JD, the weenie has already hurt our country in Iraq. A Kerry presidency will improve foreign policy prospects in every country except Iraq. In Iraq, it’s a wash.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:30 am
Stephanie. I wish there were more of you here. Freepers are notoriously frightened of a good debate and banish non-believers with alarming haste.
I’m sorry to see you in here. Most women I know are smart enough to see through President Bush’s lies and chicanery. Usually it’s the men who are too stupid (or too proud) to admit they may have made a mistake in 2000 and admit that the country needs a fresh start in a new direction.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:34 am
Anonymous – Yes, Bill Clinton was our greatest president. It’s not close. I’m not a kid, I’m 33, but if it pleases you to think of me as a kid, feel free.
It’s really mind-boggling how impervious to reality you guys are. It’s like you’re in a cult. We had our greatest president ever just 4 years ago. Don’t you remember how great things were? How optimistic we all were about the future of our economy, our planet, our civilization?
Just 4 years later, everything is in tatters. Our president is a corrupt fascist alcoholic and yet you people treat him like the messiah. It’s the darndest thing I’ve ever seen. Just shows how desperately people hate to admit that they are/were wrong.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:38 am
And the funniest thing is that it’s not like he’s promised to do stuff and you’re stupid enough to believe him. He hasn’t promised a damn thing (well, except to make his tax cuts for the rich permanent, to appoint a judge that will overturn Roe v Wade, and to tinker with health care so that 10% of the people who don’t have it now, will.)
He has driven the car off the road into the ditch and now, not only are you trusting him with the keys, but you’re giving him the keys when he’s told you that he’s not going to turn the wheel to get us back on the road, he’s heading in the same direction that put us in the ditch in the first place! So now we’re heading over the cliff.
There’s a word for creatures like that, lemmings.
Don’t drink the Kool-Aid!
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:42 am
Anyway, I appreciate your occasional lucid moments, JD, and I hope you have occasion for second thoughts in the ballot box and at least consider voting for a third party candidate rather than for the fascist shrub.
Your guy has done so much damage to America on so many levels. Why can’t you see it? Is it fear? Is it pride? Is it racism? I just don’t get it.
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 1st, 2004 at 9:44 am
Sorry, it’s late, replace “ballot box” with “voting booth”
Catch y’all later.
Hook ‘em!
JD Says: November 1st, 2004 at 12:32 pm
Ferguson you are grasping at straws, man. The problem with you leftists is you think you repeat something enough it becomes true. You eventually believe your own rhetoric. You may hate Bush but you know where he stands. He has a belief and a vision and he sticks to it. That is what grinds you liberals. You want wishy washy guys who always try to be on both sides of everything but deliver nothing. Kerry represents gridlock domestically so who cares? But as commander in chief he is dangerous. Flip Flopping incompetence won’t cut it there and that is the central issue here.
Hocus Pocus, Ferguson is the dopest! Says: November 2nd, 2004 at 4:58 am
Ferguson you are hopeless. It is really discouraging to know (that there are people that call themselves Americans like you) that actually believe like you do. I have nothing else to say on this topic, besides do you drink a lot or are you addicted to any hard drugs? I mean that with all seriousness…
Unfortunatly your Fellow American
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 2nd, 2004 at 8:36 am
Arianna Huffington says it best:
“As needy infants, this natural drive to be soothed and reassured is what we looked for in our parents; as anxious adults in these exceptionally unsettling times, it’s what we are looking for in our leaders.
Over the remaining three weeks of the campaign, as the anxiety level reaches a fevered pitch — and you can be certain the Bush campaign will do everything in its power to make sure that happens — the test facing voters is no longer, “Which candidate would you rather have a beer with?” It’s “Which candidate would you rather give you your blankie and a bottle and keep the boogeyman away?”
I know it sounds ludicrous that the most important election of our lifetime is coming down to who can best pacify the electorate’s inner baby, but I can think of no better explanation as to why Bush is not currently hovering at around 5 percent in the polls — a voting block made up of those hardcore fanatics who are as utterly blind to reality as he is.
As long as we’re operating from our lizard brains — and reason takes a back seat to more primal needs — George Bush will continue to survive the logic-based attacks on his ever-escalating failures.
The only question that remains is: Can Bush, Cheney and Rove keep us shrouded in the fog of fear long enough to brain John Kerry and win in November?”
Jonathan Ferguson Says: November 2nd, 2004 at 8:38 am
When you guys are through sucking on your bottle, wrapping yourselves up in your blankie and are willing to hear the truth, let me know.
Anonymous Says: November 2nd, 2004 at 3:57 pm
Jonathan Ferguson, I am offended that you do not think I am a smart person. I am very intelligent, and if you knew me, you would see that. I even welcomed you ,with open arms, to this site and you threw it in my face. Please do not insult me again.
Cody Says: April 26th, 2005 at 10:28 pm
Jonathan, by labeling Republicans, you are what you call us: fascist. And please, try to avoid resorting to name-calling and mockery. It makes you look stupid.